I agree go ONNO
– Last Updated: Jul-17-07 8:37 PM EST –
I have a fast tour, but there are so many options and Patrick will spend time with you helping you get it right the first time
how could you abandon…
the Pamlico 140, the best boat EVAR!! One would hope that you still have your “grey thing” and that you have moved it into the bow of your Assateague. Hate to think about paddling without a “grey thing”!
Agree with the above two posters.
The Werner Shuna in fiberglass is my favorite Euro paddle.
Hey Jaybird…
Here’s the “try a GP” opportunity you asked for. I’m both a coach and paddle-maker located up near Raleigh. If you truly are interested in trying the GP someday, that day might as well be now while you are actually thinking to buy a new paddle.
If you’d like to meet somewhere in between, we can go for a bit of a paddle, you can try the GP and we’ll do a bit of a forward stroke clinic at the same time. And with both styles of paddles. The lack of a local instructor comfortable with both paddles isn’t an issue this way.
Kudzu can come too, lord knows he needs all the help he can get, and if at the end of the day you still think the Euro is for you at least it will then be a more informed decision. I’m betting that in less than an hour you’ll be a confirmed skinny-sticker.
You’ve nothing to lose and get a class out it it too. Drop me a note off-line if you really are interested in trying the skinny-stick.
Cheers…
Bill
http://lumpypaddles.com/
off topic
Sorry but “Jaybird” caught my eye. I’m just looking for a quick answer, not trying to hijack the thread. What does it mean? My name is Jay and for as long as I can remember, females call me Jaybird. I’ve never once been called that by a guy but girls seem to love calling me Jaybird. I always ask what it means but no one ever gives me the same meaning. One girl told me it means jailbird (geez, what a nice compliment).
No idea
My folks always called me Jaybird as a kid and it just stuck. Several of my friends still call me Jaybird. I don’t know if it “means” anything.
Great!
I’ll send you an email and we’ll work out the details. Thanks for the offer. I’m looking forward to it.
More OT
"Dear Word Detective: Can you please explain “naked as a jaybird”? We have many blue jays where I live, but all of them are covered with feathers. Am I missing something? Do all their feathers fall off at some point? – M. Mercurio, via the internet.
Not that I’m aware of, though I suppose it’s not impossible. My dogs, after all, shed enough hair every summer to build a whole new dog. Maybe blue jays shed their feathers when they fly to Florida for the winter. It’s probably hard to get a decent tan when you’re covered with feathers.
The phrase “naked as a jay bird” means, of course, to be utterly without clothing. A “jay” is a species of songbird, probably most familiar to us as the blue jay, with its brilliant blue plumage and distinctively raucous call.
Just where the phrase “naked as a jaybird” came from is, however, a mystery. It has been in fairly common usage since the middle of the 20th century, and seems to be American in origin. Why blue jays, which are modestly covered with feathers, should have become symbols of stark nudity is anyone’s guess. The English have a similar phrase, “naked as a robin,” but that doesn’t seem to make any sense either.
I suppose it is possible that “naked as a jaybird” is related somehow to the use of “jay” in the 19th century for a hick or rube recently arrived in the city. This “jay” underlies our term “jaywalk,” meaning to cross the street in the middle of the block or in some other unorthodox fashion, supposedly as one unaccustomed to urban traffic rules might.
In any case, since we’re reduced to guessing, here’s mine. There are few birds more blatantly obvious than the male blue jay. Not only is Mr. Jay bright blue, not a common color for animals of any ilk, but he is also usually the loudest and most obnoxious bird in any given tree. As a symbol of that which is flamboyantly obvious, the blue jay takes the cake. “Naked as a jaybird,” therefore, might just be a colorful way of saying “blatantly and obviously completely naked.”
that’s a good assumption
because I know of quite a few paddlers who tried and/or mastered gp’s, and either swap them for euros from time to time, or have set them aside completely.
I got an Onno
– Last Updated: Jul-19-07 12:15 PM EST –
not pleased with the over-tight conventional TAP and the blade shape isn't as neutral as the Epic foam core. The adjustable Epic TAP eliminates the problem as well as providing a range of feather and length adjustment. The Onnos are a great deal price/weight if that's all the matters but once you buy something it's being used, for me the Epic performs better.
Why do you recommend building the blades up slightly? I agree as I snapped one 1/3 from the end attempting to put it together while pressing down too hard while twisting it together. I repaired it and use it occasionally but I'm not a fan of blades like the ONNO or Camano. It makes for a strong "catch" but I like something with better handling for sculling and release.
Absolutely brilliant post
Dogmaticus
Euro vs. GP
Hey Jaybird,
I’ve actually built my own paddles, both Euro and GP. After buying an Aquabound paddle and using it for a while, I wanted to try a GP to see what all the excitement was about. I tried it several times, followed all the instructions and tips I had heard and read, and went right back to using my Euro paddle.
Recently, I decided to build my own Euro paddle. I built a wood/foam/carbon fiber paddle with a large blade area. It came out pretty light at 25 ounces. I was a bit worried about the large blade area, but after a recent fundraising trip from Miami to Key West, I can honestly say that it isn’t too much blade for me. This is by far the best paddle I’ve ever tried.
Which paddle is right for you really depends on what kind of feel you like from your paddle. I didn’t like the GP for a couple of reasons. For me, paddling with a GP was like riding a bike on the lowest gear without the ability to change to a higher gear. The cadence was too fast and the resistance was too light. I like a paddle with more grip on the water. I built my GP a bit longer and wider than most of the measurement guidelines to avoid this, but it still doesn’t grab enough water. Also, I compared my speed with the GP and the Aquabound and I found that I was about .5 mph faster with the Aquabound. The speed difference between the GP and my current paddle (the Euro that I built) is probably closer to 1 mph. For a kayak that a very significant difference.
One more thing, I don’t believe that rolling or other skills are easier with a GP. I taught myself to roll on both sides, I’ve rolled with both paddles, and again, I’ll stick with my Euro.
Good luck
Pedro Almeida
Hey Recluse. I Resemble That Remark
I can use____and will accept___all the help I can get.
Let me know where and when and I’ll try to make it.
Good For You!
stepping up to the plate with some GPs for him to try.
sing
@
For the weight and price, is there really any better value than aquabound?
Euro/GP
I started from a Euro background and fell in love with GPs, but this is all personal preference.
That said, whether you like them or not, it’s a common misconception that GPs “don’t grab enough water” (except perhaps in some rock gardens where rocks prevent you from getting all the blade in the water). It’s all too easy to make a GP with too much width and length that your cadence is too slow and that is too “strong” in the water.
FWIW, my GP cadence is very similar to my Euro cadence. With both paddles (using different technique), the blades feel like they are “stuck in mud”. That said, kayaking is so different for all of us, that it would be foolish to push any one paddle type on everyone. Different is good. Find a paddle type that appeals to you and go with it. Performance is always more about the kayaker than the equipment.
Off-topic: whether it is GP or EP, many of the people that I see that paddle together use very similar equipment. I have always wondered why many paddlers form camps using very similar gear? Are many of us really that insecure of our choices that we need to copy our local peers (or local “expert”), so that we don’t have to risk criticism or explain our choices?
Maybe it’s simply a question of how long someone has been on the “group scene”. I remember that my paddling buddies used to spend hours around the campfire hotly debating EP versus GP, rudder versus skeg, ocean cockpit to keyhole to whatever. These discussions died-out among my friends years ago and now no one really cares about such things anymore. Perhaps over time you tend to focus on the similarities you share, rather the differences – or maybe you just get tired of debating the same stuff. The only thing that seems to matter is that you are an asset rather than a liability to your paddling partners. The ocean doesn’t seem to care either way and is always willing to test you…
Greg Stamer
progression
I concur - over time you get tired of the same old discussions and after a few years, you know enough to make your own decisions on paddles, boats, tow rigs, deck lines… whatever.
It’s only in the beginning of your paddling where you know nothing, that you seek out answers from others. You then learn a bit and become an EOE (expert on everything) where you need to tell everyone else why and how you do everything. Then you progress to a new point where you realize that it doesn’t really matter to you what boat, what paddle, what ever, just matters to you to get out there on the water.
Suz
Alright, Suz!
well said. Go out and have fun, especially when stirred and textured. 
sing
and function
it really is a good combo, after that it’s seconds of high end paddles and whatever a particular paddle is worth to you.
ONNO IS A Great Value!