revelation/freedom 17

So is the mad river freedom 17 the same boat as the revelation or not. I,ve asked a few salesmen who say yes. But I’ve talked to two people who have paddled both and say no.But they do not have actual measurements to compare. The factory specs do seem a little different but a salesman attributes that to sloppy measuring at mad river.Says he has been told they come out of the same mould. So why do some paddlers say the freedom has more flex than the revelation. Is mad river putting in less material now? The phone number I have for mad river desn"t seem to ever get answered. Anybody know what?s going on?

I used to wonder if my Revelation was the same as the Explorer 17 which Mad River made before the Revelation. The answer to that question was no. The Revelation was a bigger boat. That didn’t come from Mad River either, but someone on who worked for Mad River at one time. I recently saw a Freedom 17 and it did “look” different from my Revelation. Of course, the boats were not side by side at the time so I may be wrong.

Revelation/freedom 17
I see I was not specific enough. It is established that the revelation and the Freedom 17 are very similar. The freedom is not likely a new design. The questions are: is the freedom 17 a shallower boat and is mad river altering the material mix to produce a more flexible hull.

Would not be surprised…
I just unwrapped a couple of Freedom’s today from Mad River and well…yeah…they do not seem to be real stiff…I’d not be surprised if they are not as rigid as in the past. If you can find a Mad River from back BEFORE they were bought out and became part of a big conglomerate, you’ll likely find it to be better built in my oppinion.