@LurpNuts, yeah, snowflakes do melt on water. Go figure. Remember that it’s not always a good thing to be always serious. It makes one appear stiff and stuffy.
@szihn, you are correct. Even without a PFD, the body is buoyant enough to float and resist simply falling out. However, as you suggest, it was far easier to leverage myself out while under water than trying to fight gravity while upright. I don’t defend my absurd thought of pairing the condition to a burning fighter plane, but my mind does wander like that. Eh, so what. It’s not easy being me, whichbis why I find it easy to relate to Canoingwithduckheads. I can’t help wondering if that name is similar to my experience of the time spent viewing @ Upsidedownfishes.
My point is that being upside down in a kayak isn’t like being trapped in a submerged car. I simply had to make a decision whether to continue attemts to remain upright or to squeeze myself out while inverted. If I had been wearing a PFD, the rolling action would have been aided by the extra buoyancy, but staying upright was a whole different kettle of fish. At least I could have remained flat, floating phrone on the surface, with my head half out of the water @ Headhalfoutofthewater, instead of being @ eyetoeyewithfish. Rather than a sense of panic, I just felt frustration because I couldn’t remain upright. I decide to never get into such a unstable contraption again, instead preferring the relatively stability of the “tried-and-true” aluminum canoe or the ABS Coleman canoe with the aluminum reinforcing rib down the center - what did I know!
Many years later, while testing a 16 ft Royolex Old Town Penobscot canoe at a paddling demo event, my attention focused on kids testing a 9 ft Perception Swifty. The stability and open cockpit looked appealing. That test experience was far more stable and comfortable. As my confidence grew, I eventually wanted something just as stable but faster, so I bought a 140 Dualite Pungo. That was a delight that seemed like a Cadillac in comparison.
The next step was something more seaworthy, thus my switch to the 125 Tsunsmi through the 145 and finally the 175. Proof that I could have seaworthiness, speed, and stability, too. All in a kayak that didn’t make me feel like I had to walk a tight rope.
I had only been in 2 canoes in my life and both were in my 20s and 30s. When I got into kayaking I was already in my 60s. But my 1st kayak was an Old Town Loon 106. Knowing nothing at all about kayaks all my paddling knowledge was from my USMC days being trained in IBS drills and an IBS is 12 feet long, 6 feet wide and has 7 Marines or Sailors in it, along with all the gear you’ll need for the mission. So that about as different from a kayak as a school bus is to a motor cycle.
I took the Loon out on the water many times in conditions it was really not made to be used in, but having a lot of experience in IBS boats I guess I was thinking the principals would be the same. (many are not very similar)
But what that did for me is to teach me re-entries, REALLY well And a wide rec kayak is difficult to reenter compared to a slim seas kayak, but I had no knowledge of such things back then.
My 2nd kayak (and by luck, probably my best kayak I’ve ever bought thus far) was my Necky Chatham17. To be completely honest, in the first week of owning the Chatham I knew beyond any doubt I’d bitten off more then I could chew. Stability between my Loon and my Chatham felt like comparing a feed wagon to a tall bicycle. But I was thankful I had done so many reentries in the wide Loon because getting back into the Chatham was SO EASY in comparison, (but I had to get back in more too) After about a month of going out in the Chatham the tippy-ness just vanished. But jumping from a kayak with a 31 inch beam to a kayak with a 21.5" beam was an eye opener.
Now I have a Rebel TOC on the way and it’s a slight bit narrower then the Chatham, and even longer at 17 feet 10 inches. Reports on how I like it to be expected in the coming spring and summer.
When first learning to roll, it is smart to find a like minded person. I have a buddy and we practice together. On a failed roll the buddy will right your kayak, preventing the necessity of a wet exit etc. Of course, we watched appropriate videos here and there. The buddy also helps by pointing out flaws in the partner’s attempts. As it turns out, I must be a much better instructor than he is … because his roll is so much better than mine.
It’s not suicidal, but you’ll need to do many wet exits. So you would get good at wet exits and getting the water out of your kayak. It is certainly feasible, but inefficient in comparison to having the buddy. Once your roll is decent/consistent, going without a buddy is not efficient.
Make sure there is no way you can get ‘hung up’ when you wet exit. Water can always be dangerous. So the buddy does add a safety factor.
My post is a apolitical. The zealots on either side who would claim a monopoly on truth and righteousness are equally annoying … not to mention delusional.
I appreciate that honest sentiment and you are right, but the other side’s gross incompetence led to over a million people getting killed ( both sides) and a country totally blown up and destroyed in the Ukrain. That is enough for me to discount them and to never give them consideration again.
I had and still have no problem wet exiting. You simply lean forward toward the hull and float up. You might need a little shove off the sides toward the back. My kayak has a modified ocean cockpit which is small. I can’t sit in the seat and get my legs in or out of the boat. Yet I come out with ease.
Now if you feel uncomfortable being upside down in your boat then it might prove difficult. Teaching my BIL to wet exit he would be stiff or try to bend his knees, so he had trouble with it. If you feel this way don’t try it on your own. However, if you are kayaking and haven’t tried to wet exit, I strongly suggest you learn how.
This is my point. The zeolots on the other side . . . Monopolize truth . . . Delusional! I won’t defend my position. Can’t change anyones mind! You might think the way the hurricane victims in the south, and the wildfire victims in California are happy with the Mayor leaving to go to the royal party, and Nukem happy about the chance to rebuild Lost Angeles 2.0, and you cannot be aware of the number of know terrorists who came into the country and the money going to feed terrorists.
I won’t recporocate by calling you delussion. It’s simply your preference. Build bridges not walls. It’s an honorable stance. I respect your point of view. I just think suggesting Joe Biden was lucid for the past four years has been roundly busted by people on his staff. Even the networks skinked away from that lie. And the laptop was Russisn disinformation. And he wasn’t involved in criminsl enterprises, which is why he had to pardon the boy for crime past, present, and future, that he didn’t commit. That keeps the demented lunaric orsnge man from retaliating against them the way Hillary paid a Russian spy to smear him with lies. They had to stop him somehow, right.
See, we can discuss things civilly. No need to convince anybody of anything. We just have different point of view about the significants. It’s just politics. No reason to change anyone’s mind.
I wonder if anyone has an opinion about the tree ring data that I posted. Nothing to see there I guess. Tree growth rings don’t mean anything.
If you want to learn rolling on your own, there are good videos to help. You need to first practice a wet exit because that’s what you’ll need to do (in most cases) when your roll fails and no one is present to help you right the kayak. A wet exit is simple, but you might have a friend there to help in case you get bewildered the first few times - even just for emotional support if the wet exit seems daunting.
All that said, a course with a good instructor is a much better option - way superior to good videos, for example. It will save you much time and you’ll potentially get a good result. Subsequently you could practice on your own as wished.