NO NO NO!
Whatever you do, do not follow this advice. Pushing off the bottom teaches a lot of really bad habits.
Sure you can…
…learn on your own. I did. As you progress, it should take less and less effort. Try to find the “flow” to the roll. You will probably find that it takes little shoulder effort and, at least for me, comes from the waist.
Noseclips helped me lots. I’m not good at keeping water out of my nose and was only good for around eight attempts without them. But with the clips I’m good to continue on. However I always do a couple of flips with out them (usually because I forgot to put them on).
Initially I was afraid of flipping but I hate paddle float re-entries, hence I went for it:)
And now it’s been a year since I’ve blown a roll on either side.
Watching videos
We were out last week with someone who had been trying to figure out how to roll. He has had a little help from friends who can teach this, but had also looked at a lot of videos. He did a practice snap (or whatever you want to to call it) off my bow. Two of us watching noticed that he was relying on upper body and there was really no arch.
We asked him how he was thinking about the roll, and the answer was enlightening and/or interesting. His answer was that he was thinking about bringing his torso up and around the boat. The reason for this was that is what he saw in the videos. Of course you can’t see what is happening below the waist in a video.
So we talked about the roll starting below the waist, and the other paddler and I shared how we think about that motion and the body parts on which we tend to focus. Both of us were heavy on the thighs but we were different in the details. No matter - the point was that we each had an image that focused below the waist.
The guy went for a few more and the change was dramatic. Not near a roll, but thinking below the belt had him showing some arch and doing better with his head.
This probably should not be surprising - we get over 90% of our information visually. But it was a caution on videos. There is one, I don’t remember whose it is, where the guy shows the motion on land in a WW boat where the side has been cut away so you can see the lower body engagement. Anyone here remember?
second this
If you’re going to teach yourself I can’t think of a better resource than EJ’s videos.
Awesome site
As I’m reading all the helpful advice, I’m reminded of learning to post (sit a trot in a non-western saddle).
A lot of dancing metaphors came up then too.
Unfortunately my very best dance move is “the drunken white guy trying to dance”.
Seriously, if any paddlers are struggling with their riding technique, what finally worked was moving my inferior pubic ramus (seat bone)slightly toward the center of the saddle so I could feel the horse rising - rather than depend on my hopelessly inferior sense of rhythm.
All non-riders please excuse the tangent and please accept my thanks.
This is definitely the go-to site for paddling.
Did you ever jump?
Have to be able to separate upper body (still) from lower (absorb the bascule) and lower leg (provide impulsion and and balance the horse). I’m ignoring the release, but the need to have the hands be relaxed in a roll kind of relates. If there is a simile in riding, that’s probably closer than anything on the flat. Maybe if you’ve ever tried to sit the rack on a 5 gaited horse it’d be closer.
YES !!!
– Last Updated: Jun-24-11 12:10 PM EST –
To the twist....no hip snap!
On side, off side
I “taught” myself how to roll. It took me nearly 20 trips to the pool. I only practiced on one side.
My wife took a lesson. She learned in 20 minutes.
To this day, my “off side” roll (left) is much better, smoother and more consistent than my “on side” roll (right).
I taught myself so many bad habits on my on-side that I still haven’t shaken them.
Lesson learned: take a lesson, learn everything first on your non-dominant side.
D
I think Celia is referring to the DVD
Called the “Kayak Roll” sold here in the paddling.net shopping DVD section. I think i remember seeing the open boat in there. It could be helpful, i agree!
Learn
both sides at the same time…do each progressive step first on one side…then on the other.
and if you opt for the instruction route, pick a good instructor and trust them.
if they do it correctly, you will have the roll before you realize you have it (not necessarily perfected, but bubbling in your subconscious). Don’t go to the roll session with all the ideas that you have imagined working and try to have the instructor implement your sequence…remember if you do that, the instructor has turned into your spotter and not your teacher and there is usually a reason that each instructor has for doing each step a certain way…if having your ideas had worked before, you would have had very little need for the instructor in the first place.
Best Wishes
Roy
Pawlawta Roll
It’s an effective roll, but it works better with some paddles than others and, because it requires shifting the paddle, has a lot of set-up time compared to the related screw roll (or c-to-c, which I need to get down). I generally don’t teach it to paddlers as a primary roll because I’ve seen too many people lose control of the paddle blade they are trying to hold.
Pros: lots of power available on the working side of the paddle
Cons: Long set up, holding the blade can be an issue for some, lots of folks who learn this roll first tend to muscle up rather than learn good rolling technique, and the paddle must be shifted to a useful position once you recover, which is less than ideal
Rick
Yup
Good instruction is well worth the money.
Save money by teaching yourself but then spend many hours (and more dollars) correcting bad habits? You end up paying more, in the long run. There might be exceptions for extra-talented people, but other than that…
If you are hurting your shoulders…
If you are hurting your shoulders, your elbows are too high. Holding your elbows close to the body ensures that shoulders are in a strong and difficult to injure position. Note that the shoulder is a very weak joint when the arms are extended and it gets weaker and weaker as the elbows approach shoulder height (you can test this - extend one arm, press on it from the side with the other and try to keep it from moving - then bend the elbow back toward the chest and repeat - the difference is amazing). Once elbows are above the shoulder, it becomes very easy to dislocate the joint.
A good roll (even when done with hands) relies essentially on a high brace (power side of the “paddle” down and elbows below shoulder height). The paddle is nothing more than a long lever you are using to generate force against the surface of the water. The problem with long levers is that they generate a lot of force at both ends and if you expose the shoulder by getting the elbows too high, you risk potentially severe injury.
To sum up, keep elbows tucked in close to the body and let the paddle do the extension (ie. rotate your shoulder, don’t lift the elbows). A good visual clue is the shaft of the paddle - keep it below your eyes.
Rick
way to learn to keep elbows down
I’ve put a small ball under my arm and making sure it doesn’t drop keeps my elbow down. Works nice to train the muscles.