Sorry,
– Last Updated: Aug-28-08 9:54 PM EST –
one more thing. What would you all think about a Bell Yellowstone Solo if I decided on a 14 footer? And does Royalex come in any color other than red or green?
Yellowstone Solo
– Last Updated: Aug-28-08 10:53 PM EST –
I wouldn't recommend it. *maybe* down the road a bit - either a Y. Solo or Wildfire - but I fear there just wouldn't be enough boat underneath you at waterline for you to feel comfortable, stable, or enjoy the paddling. Not saying it wouldn't work, but there are better boats out there for what you're looking to do.
with a double blade, you'll like the "tucked in" gunwales of most David Yost (DY) designs, those that influenced him, and those that are influenced by him. its a little different from what we normally see as tumblehome, and it can make some of the boats look narrower than they are.
I would head to the solo boat event in PA to check things out. If not, and you're around central or eastern PA, drop in Blue Mountain Outfitters - I've always found them to be pretty up front and straightforward with what will or won't work.
western PA - there's Wind and Water; they host demos too from what I remember; and they know a lot about boats too.
Hornbeck
http://www.hornbeckboats.com/
I’d like to say that visiting Hornbeck is worth it if only for the thrill. Those are some slick boats. I’ve never been in one but I imagine it’s sort of like sitting in an eggshell. One of these days I’ll talk a rich friend into buying one so I can borrow it.
Great advice above. You get the consensus that displacement is implacable: to float you plus lunch means moving that much mass of water out from under you. If that isn’t done with length it will be done with width and depth. Width makes double-blade paddling difficult (actually it makes paddling difficult); depth makes freeboard marginal and performance unpleasant. Manufacturers are often overly optimistic about their boats’ capacity. The high end may be shy of swamping but far from fun. A short boat isn’t necessarily lighter, easier to paddle or to cartop. There are a ton of lovely solo canoes out there, though, some designed for double-blade paddles. If you want an eye-opener check out
http://gaboats.com/
The real answer is that your interests will change, refine, and your first boat probably won’t be your last. In a few years you’ll notice you have 12 canoes in the barn and start selling them on P-net. You’ll probably also start accumulating paddles and carrying more than one at a time. As you get better with a single blade you may find less call for the double blade and less need to sit low. That said, I’ll echo the sentiment to buy used, meaning cheap and readily resellable, but add that borrowing is almost as educational. Try everything you can find.
Au contraire…
First, one does not have to kneel to paddle with a single blade. In fact most paddlers sit to do this.
Second, a hull with enough volume to handle a 330 lb. paddler is probably going to have a wider than usual beam and vertical shafts can only be achieved by shifting from one side to the other, a not very good idea.
Not me…
I would never suggest a Bell Yellowstone Solo for a 330 pound paddler that is 6"3". I think that stability
would be a constant source of concern for you in that canoe.
I paddle a Royalex Wildfire/Yellowstone, and like it a lot. I am 6’4", but I am only 200 pounds.
Take a look at the Yellowstone tandem.
It could be used as a solo boat with a little re-outfitting. Stability would be better, and the capacity for gear would be much better.
BOB
Wenonah Prism
I have been paddling a kevlar Wenonah Prism this summer and am very pleased with it. I would definately give it a try to see if it fits your needs. I have been very pleased with mine.
What ever you get, give it a try before you buy.
agreed with Bob
a yellowstone tandem with either a kneeling thwart -lets you kneel and paddle solo and keep the tandem seating and yoke intact - would be a good solution. Its a blast to creek either as solo or tandem, and I’ve spent many a weekend in one. the only issue might be that there isn’t a ton of space between the paddler and the yoke in that position.
Otherwise, you can put a center seat in nearly any shorter tandem - the basic design of the boat is for displacing X amount of weight - whether its a solo paddler or a pair isn’t as relevant as whether you can make the boat do what you want it to.
there are a lot of boats out there, and a lot of opinions on here…best bet is to rent a few, demo a few, and really take the time to pull the trigger on the money cannon when you’re sure you have the one you will want to keep for a long time…the perfect boat is the one you’ll spend the most time in. It might cost more than you’re looking to spend at this point, but some things are worth the wait. when its a canoe, you really do get what you pay for…that’s why we don’t paddle kayaks!
Bubba Fire is at this point a vision
There may be a need for a WildFire for larger paddlers.
Ask Charlie at Raystown.
One I just thought of…
Old Town Pack canoe. Small, light and easily will carry 330lbs.
doh. forgot that one
And not very fast or purty. It’s reasonable but OT routinely is optimistic on weight. They give a weight that for most boats is borderline sinking…
Displacement is displacement and you guys didnt like my Solo 13 suggestion (and I agree the 14 is better).
The Pack is actually smaller…particularly depth.
Royalex or not?
Should have thought of this in the beginning (like I said, It’s all new)… While Royalex seems my best bet, how do the Kevlar type layups hold up for years of use creeks/rivers? I’m not talking WW here, just August low water level type stuff, where rock dragging is likely? Even though the cost would be higher the weight would be better. And I wouldn’t mind used.
If you don’t mind scratches
Glass and kevlar are great on rocky streams. If you would get too deep of a scratch, a little epoxy and it’s easily repaired.
I am just going to ignore the price part
and throw out the idea of a Hemlock Eaglet in solo config (Eaglet I). If you don’t take to the sport, it will hold its value well. If you do take to the sport, you will have a canoe that will make you happy for literally decades.
Hemlock?
– Last Updated: Aug-31-08 9:52 AM EST –
It's one of the sites that I've been drooling over for the last week or so. Also the Bell Magic and Merlin, and the Wenonah Argosy, Vagabond, and Prism. Of course I'd rather find any of them used instead of thinking of new prices. When you're looking at the Kevlar layups, is there much difference in how tough they are against abrasion or does it more less come down to a weight issue?
Weight/toughness/strength/durability
Yes, the layup will make a difference.
I’m 220 and I won’t buy a Kevlight (Bell) boat, because it just won’t last the way I want it to. It’s great for shaving weight, but that layup in particular is pretty notorious for being a bit “too” light for larger folk and/or rigorous use.
For your size, I’d say Black Gold or Rx in a Bell boat. Used to be you could cut the diff with White Gold, but they don’t make that anymore. The liability with Black Gold is the foam core, trickier repair than a solid laminate should you ever pierce the foam core on a rock.
As far as Hemlock layups go, either will hold you well. I think Mr. Curtis has done a wonderful thing with his premium+ hulls, with S-glass covering carbon fiber (IMHO structurally superior to Black Gold with CF outside Kev inside).
With Wenonah, yes you need to be careful about picking layups. IMHO Tuffweave or Kev Flex-core. Again, at your size I would totally avoid the ultra-light layups from Wenonah of you’re thinking of introducing the boat to rocks.
So no, it’s not just more money buys you a lighter boat that is just as strong. There are definite trade-offs. You just need to find your ideal.
Merlin II
For a solo, the Bell Merlin II is a pretty darned capable boat. I’ve creeked with it - nice when you don’t have to pay for the boat - and the Black Gold layup is really, really tough as a lot of people here will attest to. The Magic is definitely a straight-line boat, better designed for paddling on bigger water. Not a lot of sheer with the Magic, so the rougher conditions may get you a little wet unless deck covers are in place. The Merlin II is my favorite solo from the Bell line, but at 330 lbs, it might not be enough boat for you. It does run a little narrower than what may work better - the new Rockstar will be a better fit, I think.
Used Peregrine
was listed on Daves site. Beautiful boat. I own the little brother (Hemlock Kestrel) and have owned solos from Swift, Bell, Mad River, Wenonah and Souris River. The Hemlock Peregrine may work nicely for you. Best layup ever and best builder in the industry.
Hemlock
Super fine canoes.
Not at 330
Its very sluggish at that weight.
I did a weeks outing with my dog and me and gear and my dog being near 100 lbs dang near sank the boat. Boat was quite the dawg.
Overall its very trim sensitive. Because of the way it is laid up, when the UL (Kevlight)comes out of the mold the foam core flattens out.
If you buy a Merlin II with foam core actually flip it over and see what the bottom shape is. Mine is actually a little hogged.
Its a so so tripping boat.I have had others that are faster, livelier, and just as responsive
IMO finest composites are Hemlock and PBW. They use different construction processes though. Notice that fiberglass is not dead…under construction methods on the Hemlock site.
Hogged Merlin II
Interesting you should mention the hogged Merlin II. I traded my ultralight recently because the performance sure seemed different than my old white/gold model. I noticed a flattening of the hull and slight depression.