Vyneck gossip
It’s true that the Vyneck is out of production. But recently a friend of mine spoke with Nigel and was told that he’s looking for a place to start producing the Vyneck again. So there might be hope for those of you looking for the boat.
Even though the Vyneck is a wonderful tracker, I think it’s cumbersome to race a boat lacking rudder/skeg. For me there’s a big difference between a 100% power output and say 80%. When paddling at 100% there’s no room for even small correcting strokes.
Still I recently lost a race to a guy in a Vyneck. The reason ofcause was that his engine was bigger than mine.
/Peter
Nigel is a great guy and
a good kayak surf pal at times
cockpit outfitting
make sure to smooth up the inside edge of the coaming,it’s a smidge sharp. Personally the cockpit outfitting is the best in the industry for the most comfort in the showroom. What happens on the water varies considerably for each person.
I’m not sure who you’re quoting…
but I know I didn’t say “The Tempest is pretty fast for how fast it is”. I was simply giving the original poster an answer from the non-elitist functional kayak perspective. Most responses on this forum tend to focus on high-end, expensive, surf skis and racing boats. Some of us are fiscally constrained to buy standard production models like the Tempest, and I might be able to represent this cohort. I have no doubt that you surfer boys could paddle circles around me in my Tempest; I don’t think that is the issue here. I do submit that my Tempest loaded with an expeditionary amount of gear will stand up to any boat. Again, I think that’s maybe what he was asking. If not, then I stand corrected by the elitists.
Another Option
If your storage area will allow it, I’d go with an 18’ also. The extra speed will be noticeable, but the additional foot probably won’t. Try the new Valley Rapier 18. If you absolutely don’t want a rudder, this rules this one out, but it is very fast, I believe more so than the QCC/Epics. It was pretty darn competitive against some K-1 trainers, a V-10, and even a T-Bolt when I had the opportunity to race one. Of course not as fast, but it surprised me. The Navigator rudder IMHO is a POC though. It has a true ‘sea kayak fit’ also, tighter cockpit, etc., with pronounced thigh braces. I’d give the nod to QCCs/Epics for rougher conditions, but it may bridge the span quite nicely-two bulheads and VCP rubber hatches, also. If you’re after fast(er) sea kayaks, the NF Legends, VCP Aquanauts, Eddyline Falcon S-18s, CD Extremes, Kayaksport Viviennes, etc. are in this realm, but the Q700s and Epic 18s will run away and hide from them quite easily, if that’s your bent.
high end expensive
race boats expensive?
I’ve got two skis and an ICF boat that in aggregate were less expensive than a new composite touring kayak.
I even have a 2003 top end vacuum foam core carbon sprint kayak that cost me less than my fiberglass QCC cost me.
high end boat cost
That still doesn’t explain the “girly man” part of your post, but I’ll just assume you have been spending too much time watching old Arnold campaign advertisements.
For what it’s worth, surfskis are actually far less expensive most of the time than “expedition” kayaks. Sure you can spend $3000 on a new Epic V10 in carbon, but you can also get a barely used Mako for $1200 or so, and many used skis for considerably less than $1000. Not many sea kayaks at those prices. Used ICF K1’s are also quite cheap. So, I’m not sure what makes those so “elitist”. Unless taking a lot of time to learn how to paddle a demanding (and rewarding) craft is inherently more elitist than jumping in any old pointy thing that floats…
Andrew
sounds like
the T-170 would work fine for ya!
steve
What’s wrong with old pointy things?
Just thought I would lighten things up a bit. I didn’t realize how touchy the surf ski crowd can be. Sorry. I’ll just shut up and enjoy my old pointy thing by myself.
as good a minivan as any!
– Last Updated: Sep-20-05 10:57 AM EST –
Honda oddyssey,,Toyota Sienna,,all good. Or should the comparison be VW Toureg or Porsche Cayenne? aaahhhhhhhhhh!!!!
That’s what she said! L
Easy…
You were making an assumption – a common one – that surf skis are more expensive than “standard production models” of sea kayaks. You were wrong. Just because someone said so, and had numbers to back it up, doesn’t make them “touchy”.
Hmmmm
– Last Updated: Sep-20-05 12:04 PM EST –
My husband has asked several times about the Tempest 170, since I got my 165 this summer. The kayak he uses now (CD Storm) is fairly fast in calm water, but ever since that day we were running away from a thunderstorm and the water got unruly...well, let's just say that I easily pulled way ahead and felt comfortable, whereas he told me later he was downright scared.
I won't say it's entirely the kayaks being compared, because technique makes a difference, too (I can pull away from him in flat water also, if I choose to). But the Tempest does perform like a champ in rowdy water. I don't have to fight against it, it is very easy to control. Part of that is due to the great outfitting. The rest must be the hull's design.
Oh--and IF the reason you are asking about touring kayaks rather than surf skis is because you want to do camping tours, rest assured that the Tempest will perform well loaded as well as unloaded. I did a 9-day camping trip on which I carried 2 weeks worth of food.
(Above kayaks are all plastic.)
It’s called “paraphrase”
– Last Updated: Sep-20-05 2:52 PM EST –
The point is that if you narrow the comparison down to the Tempest and similar designs, the speed differences are going to be fairly marginal. Plenty of good reasons for paddling such boats, but they're designs that intentionally sacrifice speed for other qualities.
And "elitist"? Give me a break. I paddle surfskis and plastic SOTs and enjoy both. Nothing against touring SINKs either. I'm in the market for a +/- 16', pointy-ended boat myself, although the purchase has been delayed a little bit while I salivate at the prospect of a V10. But when you try the "manliness through gear selection" rubbish and get called on it, don't whine about other people being touchy.
Edited to add: there's some pretty good girly-man pictures here: http://oceanpaddlesports.com/detail_pages/ski_detail/epic-v10-intro.html
I am impressed with your photo
Truly. No malice intended. I am probably just a frustrated landlocked midwesterner quite adept at displaying my ignorance. I sincerely thought the original intent of the post was to discuss standard kayaks, not the other designs which are clearly superior in terms of speed and performance. And yes, I think you have to be an elite paddler to perform in these boats. I am not such a paddler. Perhaps I am the one who is too touchy. The Arnold-ism was probably overboard, but I was just trying to lighten things up for me and my fellow novices. I will tread lightly from now on.
Skol,
Erik
speaking of SOTS
I just paddled a Current Designs 14’ FIBERGLASS SOT,very nice.
Hay Danielblais
Why don’t you paddle mama’s boat? You might not even need to take out the hip pads. If you do, they’ll go right back. Take a GPS and see how you do.
Think “Torso torso torso”
Think “I’m gonna make her eat my wake.”
You really don’t have to be elite
It’s just a question of where you spend your time. I’m just now getting around to learning some things that a lot of people on this board take for granted, like rolling. The only real point in all of this is that there are lots of fun kayaks out there and what’s the “best” boat depends on what you’re trying to do at the time. At a bare minimum, everybody ought to have at least three (fast workout boat, touring/messing about boat, and surf boat), and four-six is better.
I apologize for being a little harsh above.
The photo, BTW, isn’t mine, although I was sitting in a barge-like plastic tandem with my son a quarter-mile or so ahead of where it was taken. For those who are interested, I think the left-hand picture in the middle row may be the wave on which Oscar got away from Baggaley. That’s about the spot where we first saw them on top of a wave and they were side by side. You can see that Oscar’s on the wave in the picture. By the time they passed us a couple of minutes later, he had a big gap.
Going to have to look at that one
There’s also some hope of seeing Epic’s little composite SOT in my local shop before too long. Might be the next boat for my wife and son to play around with.