stupid human tricks
Geez, the stupid things I have done that have caused me pain or injury in my lifetime.
The earliest I can remember is spitting on a metal slide in the school playground and finding that it made it slippery. Hey, if I spit on the slide at the top, I can slide all the way down in the “ski jump” position! Wrong! First concussion at age 4.
I used the slide in a way that it was not intended to be used and it resulted in inury. I should have had a mandatory slide class at age 3.
Swung upside down on garage door pull rope. Rope broke. 2nd concussion at age 5. I should have had a mandatory garage door pull rope class at age 4 and that would never have happenned.
I rode bicycle into dirt pile to go up the pile and possibly get some air. Dirt was too soft so front tire dug into dirt and I crunched my little kajonies on the handle bar stem. If I would have taken a mandatory dirt riding class at age 5, I never would have crunched my 6 yr old kajonies.
Of course, I could go on and on. Point is, people do things and hopefully they learn. I pay a load of taxes, that should cover a rescue or two if ever I should need one. If I do something stupid and god forbid die, I hope that some blow hard politician doesn’t use it as fodder for his legsilation du jour.
“Tolerance” includes letting someone get hurt doing some activity they want to do. Its the price of living life.
I’m A Dumbass…
I am going out this Sunday. I’ve taken one lesson and don’t know crap except that I like getting wet. Come stop me from my stupidity.
sing
starting the “outlaw paddling” club. 
Big screen/ small screen
The problem in an issue like this is that it tends to go big screen and individual actions are pretty much lost in the front page stories or the horror tales that get repeated in hearings on boat safety or before legislators. That’s compounded when some number of legislators honestly want to do the right thing. Unfortunately they lack the knowledge or background to know what the right thing is, so they do their best which is often a polar opposite.
Out of the thousands of people who hike in the Adirondacks every year, the stories that get retold time and again are ones like the woman who made it nearly to the top of one of the high peaks on Columbus Day weekend in something like platform shoes with no clothing or prep for cold weather and called for rescue (apparently the cell phone did work) when she encountered (duh!) snow.
No one I know would object to her being charged - unfortunately the rescue services lacked the ability to do so. If nothing else a hefty fee may have caused her to think about what she was doing the next time. I see charging for rescues less as a serious revenue mechanism, and more as a way to get the attention of someone who won’t figure it out any other way. Astronomically high penalties have, if not perfectly, finally managed to reduce the drunk driving issue in NY.
The post from the guy who talked about what the ATV folks did to keep control of the sport away from the guys in suits is, I think, right on this point. They saw the control nuts coming at them and aggressively did something that could be used to head them off. The same thing may well have to happen for paddling, at least in states where paddling and related rescues have very high visibility. The problem is that paddlers in general don’t organize the way that other boaters do for the most part. The ACA is the closest there is to something like a large grouping of sailboat associations or motor boat whatever, and lobbying is not really what the ACA is geared to be about.
Obviously the issue won’t be resolved on the pages of pnet. But if the cost of rescues is perceived by the public as getting high enough to impact their taxes, eventually someone will do something to make it look like they are helping. And get re-elected.
Incredible
The same person who flamed me for warning a noob about kayaks being tippy is now calling for regulations.
Face it, some of you are groupies who just like to hear yourselves talk, and as long as kayaking is more popular you don’t care if people are safe or not.
Two college students drowned last year here in Charleston. They were beginners who went out in the ocean.
I consider myself a beginner but I’m also an advanced windsurfer, so I know a thing or two about the ocean.
Anyway, I agree with the OP that a lot of these people will be at risk if they don’t have a lot of experience on the ocean. Or they might get trapped underneath on their first time out.
Can you say “actionalble”? That means lawsuits for for the store that sold it, the instructor, and who knows maybe even Paddling Net, or a book or DVD? If they don’t have media liability insurance, they sure better get a policy.
What would you do if you bought your 12 year old child a kayak, who could sail, surf, water ski, paid for lessons, and the child got suck under the boat and drowned because they tucked their pull cord in under the skirt, and everyone forgot to warn them about that?
IN another post someone asked about landing a floating dock that was higher than the deck. He said he hit his head and you guys are like, “hey pall there is something wrong with you, because that’s easy!”
BS! If the floating dock is much higher, that very tricky and I would choose another spot.
Yep
You have a point. We have become such a divisive culture again, that we’re headed back to the old yankee ethos of hating everyone we don’t know, and getting totally PO’ed seeing someone else having fun.
Having grown up in CT, this is nothing new to me. But it has become more mainstream over the last 25 years or so.
I’ve seen some fine paddlers in inexpensive flatwater boats, and I’ve seen total incompetents in $4K sea kayaks with all the latest gear. And everything in between. What matters is the boater, not the boat. If the boater has the requisite skills and knowledge for where they paddle, then it’s all good.
The only issue with inexpensive boats that I have is floatation. And that’s an issue of big box retailers not being savvy salespeople — a truly good salesperson would see the business sense of packaging float bags with the boat, and stressing their importance to the customer. But, I’m sure there’s a law firm or two that have said that doing so would be an admission of danger…
Wasn’t a flame
I suggested, a heck of a lot more mildly than some others, that you were focusing on terrifying possibilities more than might be productive. There are flames aplenty - but what I wrote was not in that category. What you responded with, as here, sure was.
You also aren't reading what I am writing very carefully. I have not "called for regulations". I have said, twice now, that if the paddling community such as it isn't fails to show some visible action to promote safety, that issue may be taken out of paddlers' hands. The ATV situation was a great example of how things can be done to head off regulations.
There is one place where concerns such as you have mentioned have directly led to regulation, albeit via insurance rules rather than governmental action. Your concern about paddlers getting trapped in a boat has been shared by insurance companies to the point that you can't use a skirt in many places to demo boats. This is a great example of the suits getting too involved - in fact if they just let people use a loose fabric skirt, it'd still fall off the coaming in a pinch. But the lawyers who worry about this aren't paddlers and don't realize that solution is available.
It really reads like you got a scare. You won't believe it but I completely get claustrophobia when in a boat upside down. I suggest that you consider doing the same kind of thing I've seen some outfitters and schools do (which I also did for quite a while) and use either fabric or quite loose neo skirts that will easily pull of the coaming without a correct release. I'm not sure you do either.
(Call me crazy, but I keep thinking that instead of an answer like the above I should just suggest supplementation for the grey thing in the bow.)
me too
The water is ~42, air ~60, I am paddling in my shorts and a splash top… And pogies - the water is cold, man.
If only someone were to make me wear my drysuit with insulating layers I would be so much safer…
Rebel without a cause 
Agree, confusion
Another mix that is going on here is that paddling skill and knowledge of safe water practices and maritime rules are getting muddled. They aren't necessarily the same.
The bike riders who run stop lights are a good example. They aren't creating any hazard because of their skill - it is their willingness to violate motor vehicle rules that creates the safety issue. BTW, road bicyclists only got permission to use the road after an active effort by the League of American (see below - Wheelman and now Cyclists) Bicyclists to work with states and agree that riders would be subject to traffic rules.
When Did This Happen…
this permission for bikers to use the road? I remember biking around 9 or 10, a little over 40 years ago.
sing
a “biking outlaw” and dumbass without realizing it.
you sure?
When did that occur? I thought it was the League of American Wheelman - guess the name was changed after I got out of cycling years ago.
are you talking to me?
I don’t think you meant to link to me, because I never said any boat should be banned.
League of American Wheelmen
The league started back when “bicycles” primarily consisted of the big wheel bicycles which were called ‘wheels’ and the operator was known as a wheelman. The leagues actions didn’t obtain the right of cyclists to use the roads, but preserved it. Back when I was a kid in the 50’s and 60’s, a lot of older folk born before and around the turn of the century still called bicycles “wheels”.
Your question? Suggestion? What?
Name and rest
Wheelmen right - me and names. I think it’s since been changed to cyclists for other reasons…
As to obtaining the right - more correct that they preserved it via their lobby. But that’s maybe syntax. Some areas had started cracking down on bikes on roads, asking that they go to the sidewalks in areas of higher traffic. I do remember a moment in time of being told I should be on the sidewalk rather than on the streets when I was younger. But too young to remember any details. Do that in many areas now and you’d get cited for running over shoppers.
I don’t want regulation…
…but its probably coming. Because of the growth in the number of paddlers, the governments will see an easy target to generate new revenue.
The article made it clear that the number of rescues per number of participants is actually low. Compared to jetskis and other power boats the death rate for kayakers is quite low. It was staggering how many more canoe deaths there are.
So why is this story in a national paper? There could be some forces at work behind the scenes who are trying to make a case for more regulation. They want to regulate kayakers because they have reached numbers high enough to make some serious coin through fees (taxes).
Another possibility is that Homeland Security would like to see registration of kayaks. On the same day this article came out in USA Today, there was a story on NPR about illegal immigrants, and maybe terrorists, using kayaks to enter the country through the San Juan Island in Washington State.
The conspiracy theorist in me wants to see a connection.
My Grandfather was a Wheelman
He used to ride them in parades and the like. They used to be quite a large organization.
Cyclists in my area started organizing about 3 years ago, and have already successfully lobbied the state on several issues concerning bike safety and access. They also do public awareness events.
Local paddlers have done the same in response to threatened registration and licensing, but the coalition seems to break up immediately after the issue is dead again, save for a few core members (Including myself on a limited basis). Bit of a difference in mentality between the two groups, I’d say.
Bikes belong on the road
They did change to bicyclists...a real shame, the old name was a great link to the past. The League started in 1880.
Bikes Predated Cars…
a "fight" between the two over "rights" to the road would have been over the control of a "new resource" -- paved roads. Had bikes been ordered off the road, I seriously doubt the capacity and the will to pursue enforcement aggressively.
Likewise, all this talk about regulations and/or education -- be these internally or externally imposed -- will be unenforceable. All it would do is lead to "fees" for government and revenues for alphabet organizations but do little, if anything, to increase safety short of curtailing personal rights and, yes, personal responsibility.
sing
Just say no to BS regs and go outlaw if the situation arise. :)
In Cases Like This…
…rather than use “Rebel without a cause”, I find “Rebel without a clue” to be more accurate!
How my freedom could be affected?
Here is how my freedom is affected: Dicks and other purveyors are selling thousands of toy kayaks that are not suitable for the waters that many people take them out in. Furthermore, many of these people are not made aware of the potential risks. As the article states there has been a huge upswing in kayak rescues.
Because of this, I suspect regulators are eyeing kayakers as a new source of tax revenue that they will push through in the form of classes, licensing, registration, launch fees and who knows what else.
I sell boats for a living. I’ve spent my life on all types of boats. Yet my favorite type of boat today is my kayak. After the initial purchase price, it is nearly free to operate in any manner I see fit. Licensing, registration and any other possible restrictions takes away the freedom we have all enjoyed as paddlers.
There is a risk of this new regulation because of all the inexperienced landlubbers who are only getting into paddling because it has become so easy and very inexpensive to buy a kayak at Dicks. One day they have never been boating, the next day they are up to their necks cold water.
I am all for every individualy being responsible for their actions. Make them pay through the teeth for a rescue. That is a better solution to me. But the regulators are looking for a good excuse to tax paddle sports and all the amateurs out in toy boats are giving them the reason.