Well kokatat must be lying http://www.outdoorplay.com/sweet-protection-intergalactic-dry-suit as sweet protection makes gortex drysuits. Maybe they meant usa made there the only one. lifetime warranty doesn’t really mean much. The manufacturer can say its life is over and not give you anything, That usually only happens after the suit is pretty old like 10 years but I know of Kokatat saying the life of the garment was over and they got nothing. They replaced it with a Sweet Protection Intergalactic GORE-TEX Drysuit
No problem with kokatat on mine 7 years old tape on inside coming lose in a few spots they sent me a new suit. People need to read the warranty it is easy to understand and gortex also has their warranty if manufacturer balks on a gortex garment.
“lifetime warranty doesn’t really mean much”
I’ve had two Gore-Tex jackets that were over 12 years old and a dry suit that was ~10 years old replaced under warranty, so Gore’s warranty definitely means something. It’s important to note that while Kokatat could deny a warranty claim, Gore is the final arbiter since the warranty against delamination is on the fabric, not the garment. In the case of my dry suit, the manufacturer no longer made Gore-Tex suits, so Gore replaced it with a Kokatat suit. More than that, they replaced it with a more expensive model and refused to take any money for the difference in price.
So, don’t try to tell me that Gore’s warranty “doesn’t mean much”.
Totally agree
DC,
Do you have details about this Kokatat rejection? I carry Kokatat at The River Connection and I’m familiar with their policies so this scenario is of interest.
See you on the water,
Marshall
The Connection, Inc.
9 W. Market St.
Hyde Park, NY
845-228-0595 main
845-242-4731 mobile
Main: www.the-river-connection.com
Store: www.the-river-connection.us
Facebook: fb.me/theriverconnection
@dc9mm said:
Well kokatat must be lying http://www.outdoorplay.com/sweet-protection-intergalactic-dry-suit as sweet protection makes gortex drysuits. Maybe they meant usa made there the only one. lifetime warranty doesn’t really mean much. The manufacturer can say its life is over and not give you anything, That usually only happens after the suit is pretty old like 10 years but I know of Kokatat saying the life of the garment was over and they got nothing. They replaced it with a Sweet Protection Intergalactic GORE-TEX Drysuit
Got my suit 7 years ago so in may have been then or they meant made in USA.
My friends suit which is the exact same suit as mine ( I have no idea what the name of his/mine is but its gortex. Yellow and blue color., it was slowly leaking last summer but we couldn’t figure out where. he sent in and they responded with they felt the life of the suit was over and offered him a 20 percent discount on a new suit. They didn’t say where it was leaking just that its life is over. He had them send it back to him at a 20 dollar cost. He bought a Sweet Protection Intergalactic GORE-TEX Drysuit to replace it. I have the exact same kokatat suit BUT I bought mine used so I know I have no warranty but he bought his new BUT didn’t have an receipt as it was around 14 or more years old. He didn’t try and check with gortext as he wasn’t even sure where it was leaking as Kokatat didn’t say. He wasn’t mad as it was old but as I said lifetime isn’t lifetime. Since the company at any time can say the suits lifetime is over Lifetime warranty doesn’t mean much. Not saying Kokatat isn’t a good company that makes great products, just don’t by into the lifetime warranty hype. . So other manufacturers do offer gortex, thats why I posted mainly.
Just notice bnystrom response. I have no idea about the Gore company I was talking about kokatat not gore. Since he didn’t know were the suit was leaking not sure how gore would have helped.
Gore would have examined the suit and if the fabric had delaminated, they would have replaced it.
One thing to keep in mind is that if the fabric is cut, torn or simply worn through, that’s not covered under warranty, since it’s not a defect in the material, it’s wear and tear.
@bnystrom said:
Gore would have examined the suit and if the fabric had delaminated, they would have replaced it.One thing to keep in mind is that if the fabric is cut, torn or simply worn through, that’s not covered under warranty, since it’s not a defect in the material, it’s wear and tear.
We both looked over the suit before he sent it in. Couldn’t see any cuts and certainly not worn through any were. I thought there must be some pin wholes in it some were . He didn’t bother trying to like pressurize the suit to look as he thought kokatat would handle it. He was happy the suit lasted that long but doubtful Gore would have done anything but you never know. Just saying lifetime does NOT mean YOUR lifetime. its the suits lifetime. How long that is is arbitrary amount of time. Read this http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f15/the-kokatat-lifetime-warranty-59483.html
@dc9mm said:
Just saying lifetime does NOT mean YOUR lifetime. its the suits lifetime. How long that is is arbitrary amount of time. Read this http://www.mountainbuzz.com/forums/f15/the-kokatat-lifetime-warranty-59483.html
Interesting thread, but why in the heck did he use 303 on the zipper every couple of weeks instead of following Kokatat’s instructions?
All Kokatat products are fully guaranteed to the original owner against defects in materials and workmanship for the reasonable life of the item. Products found to be defective will be repaired or replaced at Kokatat’s option. Repairs due to normal wear and tear, accident, abuse, etc., will be made for a reasonable charge. Latex gaskets are not covered by the Kokatat warranty. There is a 2 year limited warranty on all TROPOS suits. Kokatat specifically disavows any other representative warranty or liability relative to the condition or use of the product.All Kokatat products are fully guaranteed to the original owner against defects in materials and workmanship for the reasonable life of the item. Products found to be defective will be repaired or replaced at Kokatat’s option. Repairs due to normal wear and tear, accident, abuse, etc., will be made for a reasonable charge. Latex gaskets are not covered by the Kokatat warranty. There is a 2 year limited warranty on all TROPOS suits. Kokatat specifically disavows any other representative warranty or liability relative to the condition or use of the product.
I am not a lawyer but the warranty seems simple enough to understand. I had no problem with my 7 year old suit when tape lifted from seam. I paddle a decent amount. I cleaned the suit with Nikwax for 25 minutes in the sink then rinsed it further outside with the hose. The guy in the other forum said he thought it was clean. I mean if you have a shirt you wore or pants yo be repaired and you wore them once would you clean them before dropping them at the tailor? I certainly would.
I was hoping for a free repair and I got a new suit cost me 70 bucks to ship USPS with 1200 insurance. I took care of the suit and probably walked from house to kayak deck box on plastic decking twice in all these years. Gaskets lasted 7 years. Flooded gaskets all the time when done. 304monthly. To much 303 ruins the gaskets.
I was impressed by the product and the service they provided. It’s gortex not steel so it could wear out. I don’t do much in the suit except paddle. I don’t land and explore or chop wood in the suit. One of the simplest warranties I have read.
So I think we agree. its the suits life not the customers life. But hey he got some were around 15 years which is pretty good. I just see people say its a lifetime warranty a lot online and get the impression people think they will never have to buy a new suit. Maybe my impression is wrong.
Rookie I never said anything about 303 on the zipper, you quoted me so I assume that was directed at me.
@PaddleDog52 said:
All Kokatat products are fully guaranteed to the original owner against defects in materials and workmanship for the reasonable life of the item. Products found to be defective will be repaired or replaced at Kokatat’s option. Repairs due to normal wear and tear, accident, abuse, etc., will be made for a reasonable charge. Latex gaskets are not covered by the Kokatat warranty. There is a 2 year limited warranty on all TROPOS suits. Kokatat specifically disavows any other representative warranty or liability relative to the condition or use of the product.All Kokatat products are fully guaranteed to the original owner against defects in materials and workmanship for the reasonable life of the item. Products found to be defective will be repaired or replaced at Kokatat’s option. Repairs due to normal wear and tear, accident, abuse, etc., will be made for a reasonable charge. Latex gaskets are not covered by the Kokatat warranty. There is a 2 year limited warranty on all TROPOS suits. Kokatat specifically disavows any other representative warranty or liability relative to the condition or use of the product.I am not a lawyer but the warranty seems simple enough to understand. I had no problem with my 7 year old suit when tape lifted from seam. I paddle a decent amount. I cleaned the suit with Nikwax for 25 minutes in the sink then rinsed it further outside with the hose. The guy in the other forum said he thought it was clean. I mean if you have a shirt you wore or pants yo be repaired and you wore them once would you clean them before dropping them at the tailor? I certainly would.
I was hoping for a free repair and I got a new suit cost me 70 bucks to ship USPS with 1200 insurance. I took care of the suit and probably walked from house to kayak deck box on plastic decking twice in all these years. Gaskets lasted 7 years. Flooded gaskets all the time when done. 304monthly. To much 303 ruins the gaskets.
I was impressed by the product and the service they provided. It’s gortex not steel so it could wear out. I don’t do much in the suit except paddle. I don’t land and explore or chop wood in the suit. One of the simplest warranties I have read.
@dc9mm
Realize it wasn’t you. It was the guy in the mountainbuzz thread you cited complaining about Kokatat. He wrote:
“Having already had a dry suit go down hill quickly i lubricated the zippers with 303 every couple weeks while in use and kept the suit clean.”
OK Yea I wouldn’t use 303 on a zipper.
The point of the Gore warranty is to protect against defects in the material (fabric). They consider delamination to be a defect and it doesn’t matter how old the garment is. Kokatat’s warranty adds the additional element of defects in workmanship. I think the “lifetime of the garment” bit is a pretty sketchy, as it’s completely arbitrary and IMO, that’s not a lifetime warranty. For that reason, I wouldn’t accept Kokatat’s rejection of any delaminated Gore-Tex garment that was not otherwise damaged; I would go directly to Gore because I know exactly what their warranty means and I know from experience that they stand behind Gore-Tex 100%.
When a company makes a garment out of Gortex the manufacturer has to make the garment and submit it to Gortex for approval before they can sell it.
I wonder about instances where the customer CAUSED the delamination.
I say that because I have been guilty of doing so. Even though I should have known better, since I was working in the outdoor gear biz when Gore-tex hit the market in the 1970’s and had received specific training on how it should be cared for (information I had transmitted to thousands of customers) I still did something stupid.
I had an international orange hooded Gore-tex shell that I used for all kinds of activities, including as rain gear on the construction sites where I was a project manager. This meant it often got quite dirty so I laundered it often, always by hand or on machine gentle cycle with Woolite or baby shampoo. Never any problems for the 10 or 12 years I had it.
Then it got really cruddy including some bike chain grease on the sleeves. So I sprayed the entire jacket with one of those pre-wash stain-release products before putting it in the washer. When I went to remove it after the wash cycles, I found to my horror that enormous areas of the white inner membrane had sloughed off the orange nylon in shreds! The jacket was ruined and I had to pitch it. Though it wasn’t a great financial loss (bought it at great mark-down at EMS – apparently nobody liked that eye-blinding orange) and I got over a decade of use out of it, it was one of the most useful rain shells I ever owned and I still miss it – had an oversized hood and long tail for bicycling so it fit over my hard hat nicely. I don’t even remember the brand (might have been Class 5 – many of the early Gore-Tex shell makers are gone now).
Apparently whatever solvent was in the spray had destroyed the bond adhesive between the laminates. Gore’s own advice page for dry-cleaning companies warns about this, but I don’t know if the average owner of a Gore-Tex garment is aware of the danger of pre-spotting solvents.
You can’t expect a company to pay for misuse of their product although I am sure they do many times.
I certainly would not have expected compensation for my own stupidity. But I wonder if they do get cases where people have used solvent stain releases on a more limited basis.
I am sure they have seen everything by now