awww shucks…
i’m blushing.
Why?
There are a couple of advantages to doing all those Greenland Rolls, which are the reasons the Greenlanders invented them in the first place.
First one is mental. If you can do all those various rolls, being capsized is not as big a deal. You’ll succeed far more often if you believe you can, especially if you know that you can do it more than one way.
Second, you are learning to roll from any position you may find yourself in without having to “set up”. Sometimes current will not allow someone who is a “One trick pony” to set up on the one side they can roll on for the one roll they know how to do. What happens then? They bail. If they knew how to roll not only on both sides, but also from the body position they found themselves in, they’d have a big advantage.
I was playing in a reversing falls last November and capsized in the heaviest part of the current. I was pinned against the rear deck by the current. So, I waited for the boat to catch up to the current a little, and initiated my roll from where I was — on the back deck (With a euro paddle). Someone who only knew a c-to-c might have swam in the same situation.
Why say that there is only one roll you need to know? What if someone’s physique favors a different roll that they could do easily in any conditions they’d normally find themselves in? Personally, my “go to” roll is a reverse sweep. If I can’t roll any other way, chances are I’ll pull that one off easily. I wouldn’t know that unless I had learned a bunch of different rolls to begin with. Everything you learn in paddling helps with at least two other things, so why not learn a whole bunch of stuff if you enjoy it? And if you only want to learn one roll, hey, that’s fine too. It’s about fun, not dogma.
No problem with Greenland rolling
you might consider the idea that the only problem with greenland rolling exists in your head.
Greenland rollers are surely a diverse bunch; some are no doubt into rolling as a challenge, a fun thing in itself, or for the pure aesthetics, and rarely paddle long distances or in rough water. Some are no doubt into rolling as a tool to develop for use in rough water paddling. Some are into roilling for both reasons. Some want to show off, or identify with a cult. Some are into the gear and the trappings. So what? There’s no law that dictates that Greenland rolling should be pursued for one purpose or another.
It would be better to focus ones angst and mental energy to inquire into more profound metaphysical issues , like:
Why are there braille pads on ATMs at drive- through windows?
How do you throw out a trash barrel on trash day?
Why did Cootiie Wiliams sing "Don’t get around much ‘henty’ more " rather than "any more " in Duke Ellington’s 1941 rercording of that song?
It seems that you
are not interested in greenland paddling or learning new skills and thats just fine. I have had many circumstances when getting rolled in rough conditions that I just popped back up without any set up or even thinking about it because I have learned many of the greenland rolls. These many different rolls have enhanced my paddling time and allowed me learn other new skills in conditions that I would be limited in. It can make you feel like a duck in water. Don’t get me wrong I still get humbled when I’m paddling in extreme conditions that I don’t spend a lot of time in. It’s not for everyone and that okay.
Answer me these questions three:
"It would be better to focus ones angst and mental energy to inquire into more profound metaphysical issues , like:
Why are there braille pads on ATMs at drive- through windows?
BECAUSE ITS THE SAME ATM AS THE WALKUP TYPES.
How do you throw out a trash barrel on trash day?
PUT A SIGN ON IT THAT SAYS TAKE ME,TOO!
Why did Cootiie Wiliams sing "Don’t get around much ‘henty’ more " rather than “any more " in Duke Ellington’s 1941 rercording of that song?”
MICK JAGGER ONCE HAD A CONVERSATION WITH CHUCK BERRY WHO’d ADVISED HIM TO NOT TO MAKE ALL LYRICS COMPLETELY INTELLIGIBLE BECAUSE ITS AN ADDED HOOK TO GET THE LISTENER TO TUNE IN CLOSER. COOTIE WAS LIKELY DOING THE SAME THING. ADDITIONALLY, ALCOHOL MAY HAVE BEEN INVOLVED.
Seems as though mysteries don’t need metaphysics but a little front porch common sense. GP or Euro?
Dogmaticus
Agree with Salty
Have fun on the water. It’s sort of the difference between bouldering and mountaineering. They are both climbing.
I’m betting there are at least as many Euro paddlers as Greenland paddlers who’s rolls fail them in big conditions.
It’s not about the boat or the paddle:
http://www.capefalconkayak.com/biggersurftraining.html
Alison basically
told me I wasn’t flexible enough to do a forward finish 
I was disappointed to say the least. Maybe next year?
I did learn a lot about the"Gray area" from Bianica though.
any forward finishing?
If you can sit up in bed, you can do a reverse sweep roll. Now forward finishing hand rolls and stuff do require a bit more flexibility and technique.
mysteries don’t need metaphysics
– Last Updated: Jun-20-07 12:28 PM EST –
Lots of good lines in this thread -- though the definition of a bombproof roll might be my favorite.
This past weekend on the Deerfield reminded me that paddling is paddling.
Earning the scrapes on my helmet from capsizing and rolling in ww is the same as earning them in surf, the same as earning them in a tidal race.
"It is all good"
I have trouble recovering
from the chest scull. I thought I’d done that in the pool but couldn’t do it in the Hood Canal. Tough call weather to work on it tonight at the pool, or take a break and hit the river this weekend for some paddling, or do both!
Paul
The best way to improve your roll,
In the river: Playboating
In the ocean: lots of time in the surf zone.
You get plenty of opportunity to refine the mechanics while becoming comfortable with spending time underwater. And that underwater time is important.
My 2 cents,
Bob
One problem I’ve noticed in clubs…
One problem I’ve noticed in our club is that a good fraction of the members feel that the somewhat increasing emphasis on rolling is an unwanted distraction for them. For their type of leisurely paddling they see it as unnecessary. Some even seem offended. Some don’t own appropriate boats. Some may have physical issues. One older woman told me she quit the club because of the “new direction” it seemed to be taking.
Different Activity
Some people are just involved in a different activity. There are people who go out on calm days looking for birds, others who go out in hurricanes looking for waves. Some like to spend time crossing eddy lines, others like finding new awkward ways to right a capsized kayak.
While there are a lot of people who actively pursue several different kayaking related activities, there are people for whom rolling is the end goal. They like the challenge and motion and are not turned on by the idea of paddling long distances in the wind or against a current.
Some people like to run, others like to do yoga. Both use approximately the same equipment, but they are different activities. There are good runners who do yoga, and skilled yoga practitioners who like to run, but interest in one does not imply interest in the other.
Kayaking is just a form of recreation. If you are having fun in a kayak, you are doing it right.
It’ll pass
We had a spring of some less than complimentary comments as well, when we had a sudden increase in people doing more non-upright stuff because a bunch had gotten their roll and similar skills over winter pool sessions. One thing that the rec boaters didn’t understand at first was that no one was trying to show off or be difficult - it was just one more thing that required regular practice and a hot summer night after work was a pretty compelling opportunity to do that. They understood it better over time, as they realized no one was going to press them to try, and especially as the temperatures got into the high 80’s.
Give it time - the few folks who leave the club because some like rolling are likely to be resentful of a lot of other things too. The rest will get over time that it is just a part of paddling.
from my original posting
why arguably? if you wanna be a Greenland hero for it’s own sake, who am i to challenge that?
RELAX - IT’S RECREATION
It’s fun reading all the banter about rolling. But troubling a bit as well. I whitewater, sea kayak, flat water, rough water. It’s all recreation. Have some fun, enjoy what you chose kayaking for whether it’s bird watching, fishing, rough water, whitewater, eddy hopping, rolling gymnastics, whatever.
For me, it’s a water sport, so I like to get wet. And I like to learn new things. Focusing on learning skills is a nice way to get my mind off the days stresses. And learning rolling skills is a great way to develop your felxibility, paddle dexterity and boat control. I found that working hard at rolling skills improved all my other skills, edging, bracing, directional control, relaxation, confidence, knowledge of what my boat could and could not do in various conditions.
When I get ready to go out in rough surf the first thing I do is get into the waves and roll to make sure I’m ready for the day. Then static brace or side scull up and down over the waves, it’s fun, it’s a sport.
Hope everyone can lighten up, stop feeling threatened and enjoy what they got into the sport for and stop criticizing others for enjoying themselves.
Absolutely!
Some are grumps
– Last Updated: Jun-23-07 11:11 AM EST –
jbv seems to be a bit of a grump lately. He was grouchy about some of the Impex boat model names a couple of weeks for no discernable reason, the profile seems to want a fight, and this original post is in keeping with the trend. I keep thinking that all the boats must be in the shop.
Expression is good
– Last Updated: Jun-23-07 2:02 PM EST –
even if it bothers the norm here. I think in fairness to Jbv we need to recognise that we all carry similar simplistic ideals around to some extent. The guy simply posted some of his current thinking. One might conclude that harsh judgement of him is synonimous with his harsh judgement of greenland hero's??? Just a thought.
Disagreement is healthy and good.
No problem…
– Last Updated: Jun-23-07 2:10 PM EST –
I think, as you say, that jbv is very much posting his own thoughts. It was his broader statement that the greenland folks he sees are the master of no skills that got things going - that was not going to go by without comment.