Thoughts on kayak purchase (small woman)

good deal!
and, as you posted, it’s important to leave $ for a good paddle. Once read somewhere that experienced kayakers will paddle whatever might be available, but they will fight over paddles :slight_smile:



Another reason to buy used… a paddle, skirt, cockpit cover, even a car rack system, might be included. Saves a lot of $$.


Update
Sorry for the late update! The weather was funky down here last weekend and I wasn’t sure if I was going to be able to take my lesson or demo last Saturday morning, but the weather ended up being beautiful. My instructor was great and I learned quite a lot. I learned forward & rudder strokes, some sculling and bracing moves, and a paddle float re-entry. It was a lot to digest! My instructor was impressed that I caught on so quickly and that I was a powerful paddler–it felt good to know I was doing it right, lol. The kayak I used was a Venture Islay 14.



As for the demos, I tried the Suka first. Despite the narrow hull, I had no problem sitting in this kayak and being stable. I must say that the cockpit opening on this kayak is small (again, I am 145lbs with 39” hips). I was able to fit my bum in, but I wouldn’t have been able to if I was an inch or two larger in the hips. It was a snug fit and I enjoyed the feeling of more maneuverability/response that it gave me. I don’t think I would have had too much trouble getting in and out of it in the water, but it did take some attention when putting one leg in a time. It seemed pretty quick and tracked well (I was paddling into a head wind most of the time, as it was windy that day and on a fresh water lake). Perhaps the one thing I did not like so much was the straight-ish leg position you must use for this kayak. I ended up with a bad calf cramp when using an aggressive forward stroke and I think it was because of this leg position. I did not have this issue with the other 2 kayaks. I also did not have much room to bring my legs up into a “froggy” position. I don’t think I would like this if I was paddling for day trips over an hour, as it would be nice to relax and bring my legs up once in awhile (e.g. just sitting in the kayak). All in all, I liked a lot about the Suka (the narrow hull mostly), except the (almost) straight leg paddling position. The seat width may have been a bit too small, but it wasn’t uncomfortable at any time.



The other boat I demo’d was the Raven and I liked it as well. Stability felt fine to me as well, no problems there. It felt a bit slower than the Suka, but I know the Suka is a faster boat, so I was expecting this. It’s also a bit heavier, so that’s to be expected. The cockpit area was certainly roomier than the Suka, but I didn’t feel like it was a gigantic void. The seat can move forward and backwards and that helped get my knees to the thigh braces. If I owned this kayak, I may or may not have to pad it a bit in the hip area and thigh braces. Like the Venture I took the lesson in, I had to use a “froggy” leg position and that felt fine to me. The hull is only an inch wider than the Suka, but I could tell the extra bit of width when reaching up for a forward stroke. Maneuverability felt good. Truthfully, I was starting to get tired at this point and the weather was getting much worse (windier), so I wasn’t able to evaluate it as much as I would have liked. It was getting close to the closing time of the shop, so I just didn’t have much time left to play with it.



I plan on going back this weekend and taking another look at the Raven (and maybe another demo). I liked the kayak and it would suit what I would want to do. I might prefer a slightly smaller volume kayak, but not at the expense of not being able to bring my legs up once in awhile.



I also called another kayak shop located almost 4 hours away and they didn’t have much in my price range (


that interested me (below $2,000). Closest kayak was a very scratched up, used glass P&H Capella 163. Reviews for the kayak appear ok, but it doesn’t excite me much.

used stuff…
Katabatic,



I would love to buy used everything, but I am learning that despite being surrounded by water in FL, finding used kayaks that appeal to me is pretty darned tough!

nice boats
I missed something - I thought your budget was $1000?



It seems like you’ve honed in on two of the finest boats on the market. I would think the Suka would be preferable - lighter, lower, sleeker, faster. But either is a boat for your lifetime. The cockpit and foredeck seem a little more “generous” on the Raven, but the Suka is lighter. Personally, I think you would quickly get used to the leg position. I paddle a Caribou (larger version of the Suka), and have no discomfort. I’m 5’7" and around 180 lbs (a little overweight at the moment), and have had the boat for 15 years and see no need to consider anything else.

Leg position
Current thought about having a good forward stroke calls for a deck on the slightly higher side than some years back, because most favor a high angle stroke. A slightly higher deck allows for for pedaling to increase torso rotation. I agree I can pedal a bit better in my boat with a higher deck. But if I had to pick one thing that makes for a better shot at a good stroke in that boat, it’d be the half inch or so diff in boat width by my hips.



And I agree with one of your concerns - somewhere about an hour and a half or two in the boat, you do better if there is enough room to stretch out and wiggle around a bit in the boat.



Just thoughts. In any case, it sounds like you are doing well.


that’s interesting

– Last Updated: Sep-17-14 9:14 PM EST –

"Current thought about having a good forward stroke calls for a deck on the slightly higher side than some years back, because most favor a high angle stroke."

Where is this current thought? Not doubting you, just wondering if you can guide me to something about this.

I would think a lot of people might disagree, especially those who use a GL style paddle. Both of the boats in question are GL style boats, no? Anyway, is there any reason you couldn't use higher angle stroke with a Greenland style boat with low decks? Seems kind of a puzzlement to me...

To pedal more effectively

– Last Updated: Sep-18-14 11:43 AM EST –

Pedaling seems to be more talked about for high angle paddling, as least in my experience. And I haven't had a class in forward stroke that was not about high angle paddling in a few years or so now. The height of the deck against what the torso and arms are doing above the coaming is not in play here since all the boats in question are low enough that way.

I have also seen a variety of approaches to paddling with a GP - at least a couple of highly regarded GP folks I know use what they feel is a high angle stroke.

great stuff
Really valuable seat time, that the instructor had you go through some strokes and move about. And those are both pretty good boats, either one could be the last boat you’ll want. The Raven has plenty of room for tripping IMO, and looks like a boat that one could use to play in surf.

Another update…
Will be stopping by to take another look at the Raven tomorrow morning to check fit again, but then, this afternoon, I happened to find a used carbon/kevlar Impex Montauk a few hours away and will be taking a look at that as well.



Tough choice, any thoughts comparing the 2? I just don’t want a boat I will outgrow.

another nice boat
It depends o wat kind of paddling you’ll do, bt the only real drawbacks I see to those boats is that they don’t have pace like a QCC or Epic. But they’re all seaworthy and good in rough water, the Montauk particularly. Paddled one once and it felt playful enough to imagine it’d be fun in conditions. And it’s composite.

Sumognat…

– Last Updated: Sep-21-14 10:38 AM EST –

I've been following your quest here on P.net. I had to go over to the Naples shop yesterday to make connections on an in-transit kayak that I had sold several years ago and was coming back to me. Very happy about that.

Guess I missed you but saw the boats you were looking at. They are both very nice boats.

Best of luck, GH

South Florida
Where in South Florida are you??? I have had no problems finding new and used sea kayaks, sea kayak instructors or liveries with a big enough assortment to try out different boats. If you are really going to develop a roll, I would find an instructor first and get his/her help on a first kayak. The boat is going to make it harder or easier to learn this skill. Go with easy.

comparing Suka & Montauk
I know both boats well. The Suka very well (have one in kev/fg) and the Montauk via paddling friends’ kayaks.



you are brilliantly fitted for an Impex Montauk



As a first seakayak, imo, it is friendlier to acquiring skills than a Suka. CD developed the Suka for the intermediate to advanced small paddler. I got this direct from their then sales manager. They designed the Suka as a niche boat.



I got mine when I edged past intermediate. I like it fine, I expected it to be twitchy. It’s fast. The waterline beam is 18" and it likes to lay over on its hard chine. To enjoy a Suka you have to like deep edging and can’t hesitate in your bracing and carving.



With a Montauk it will be more forgiving and "protect’ the paddler better from learning as you go kind of mistakes. sort of like a Romany.



Rolling is easy in a Montauk. Seen paddlers roll one on their first few tries. Suka is not hard, but not the easiest either.



Montauk is descended from the North Shore Shoreline. Pls. google that boat it’s well regarded tho little known here. NOrth Shore kayaks are finally gaining some ground in the U.S. since they are now distributed to Valley Sea Kayak dealers.



I’m pretty sure the Montauk will be more budget friendly than the Suka, leaving your room for a quality pfd and paddle, for example. And another lesson, seems like you are catching on fast!