one paddle
Kayaking is a big part of my life. Try to do trips south in winter to kayak and do 1500 miles some years in our 7 months of nice weather. Love races such as 70 miler and blackburn 20 mile ocean race. I own one paddle. It is a turbo wing. Same paddle that won olympic gold in Athens. Wings rule. Anything less than a wing is like a $300 coleman canoe
I saw 1+ mph with wing
I will attest to huge increases in performance once I committed to a wing paddle and rudder. I will admit that much of it had to do with my technique improving. The wing paddle forces good technique.
The full time rudder also makes a huge difference becasue now I can focus nearly all my energy to paddling forward.
Overall the increase in power is closer to 100%. Look at drag curves for kayaks. look at how much force is needed to go from 5 mph to 6 mph. Now think about maintaining that for 3 or 4 hours day after day.
Plus once you are able to easily cruise at 6 and due quick surges to 7 - 7.5 mph, you are suddenly able to catch and stay on waves that would have rolled on by. The wing and rudder will let you paddle at the speed of the ocean. Once there, huge increases in speed and distance traveled for a given amount of energy are possible downwind.
Like probably 95% of the folks here I thought I had good roation and was paddling correctly before the wing. After 3 or 4 paddles with the wing my technique was changed for the better. If you want to paddle like Zsolt, Barton, Chaplasky, you must go to a wing and rudder.
Its NOT the Paddle
Occasionally this discussion about big blade/slow cadence vs. small blade/fast cadence comes up here on P.net. I often struggle with this debate because there are two other very important components of the equation that are rarely mentioned: Kayak Drag and Paddler Power.
The drag of the kayak is critical. Newton proved that for every action there is an equal and opposite. So the force the paddler generates through the paddle is equal to the drag from the boat through the water and to a lesser degree drag of boat and paddler through air. Its not the paddleās drag that is the problem. Its the kayakās drag that creates stress in the body.
Going to a smaller blade that āslipsā through the water is not that different than a clutch slipping as a car drives up a hill. Sure it eases the load on the engine, but there is also energy wasted. So one could go to a smaller blade and work it faster to ease loads on joints and muscles, but the price is wasted energy through vortices spinning off the paddle.
Paddler Power is the other critical component. This was discussed here somewhat in this string. I believe paddler power is much more influenced by technique than muscle mass. If your arm & shoulder joints & muscles are strained you are simply not paddling correctly. It always seems that the advocates of smaller paddles including Greenland paddles always tout how much less stress they have on their joints and how much longer they can paddle. I frankly do not think most of these people are paddling with the best technique or they wouldnāt have these complaints in the first place.
Okay I expect to get beat up for that statement, but there are always exceptions. So if you are feeling the need to attack me right now, then just consider yourself one of the few exceptions. Its all the other guys that do not paddle correctly.
I was one of those guys. I was much like the original poster of this thread. I had a longer kayak (QCC700). I used a modern flat blade paddle. I shunned rudders because all the āexpertsā told me rudders were bad. I was fit enough to work the modern paddle fast enough to move along at 6 mph for a while. My average speeds were in the 4.7 - 5.2 mph range over a 2 - 3 hour paddle. When I tried a wing paddle it felt like paddling in concrete. An hour of a wing was more than I could handle. Basically my arms and shoulders did not have the power to match the resistance caused from the QCC700. The wing did not offer any relief to my muscles or joints by by slipping backwards through the water.
It was not until I fully committed to the wing and full time rudder that I started paddling correctly using torso muscle power. Now kayaking is an aerobic activity. Its my lungs and cardio that gives out before muscles. My engine power has more than doubled. The wing does not give an inch. All my energy is focused on pulling the kayak forward. I do not have strained joints or tired muscles. My arms are actually kinda small.
Now I feel like I need a longer faster kayak because my power curve is ahead of my kayaks drag curve. Its the complete opposite problem of those looking for a smaller blade for relief.
I just have a feeling that anyone who seeks relief by going to a smaller blade is moving in the wrong direction. Wouldnāt it make more sense to maybe get a kayak that has a drag curve better suited to your power curve? Or even better, revise your power curve upward until it matches or exceeds your kayakās drag curve. This is done by developing your technique so you are truly using torso muscles, not arms and shoulders. When you do this correctly you will find that a larger, more grippy blade is what you prefer.
I typically agree with youā¦
ā¦ and Iām not actually disagreeing with you here.
However, I think your comments on Greenland paddle/technique are based on your interpretation of random comments - and and not on experience or understanding of the paddle the way your wing comments are. If Iām wrong on this let me know.
Trying a GP doesnāt count any more than a few minutes with a wing does. Trying a GP in a wide boat also has the same problems doing so with a wing does. Put a few thousand miles on one, and find out for yourself. Otherwise, talking about GPs adds nothing positive to your posts.
Iām not debating your wing/rudder for milking the bumps stuff. Thatās just common sense. Iām simply suggesting your euro/wing background may have you misinterpreting/mis-characterizing the GP (which is a wing in its own right).
Iāll be the first to agree that the majority of GP users arenāt into ticking off miles, or maintaining even fair speed over distance. That doesnāt mean all are not, and it has little to do with the paddle. Iāll also agree the GP is a general/multipurpose paddle and not optimized for fit athletes looking for maximum speed in the way a wing is. This is not news.
Iāve let a lot of people try my GPs. The one who took to it fastest, got the feel for the blade in the water quickest, and seemed to get it/appreciate it most - had never used anything but a wing before.
Then thereās the time Maligiaq paddled a ski in Miami using his GP and was beating the wing usersā¦
Keep preaching you wing/rudder thing. Itās good stuff. Itās stands on itās own and you donāt need to talk down other gear or paddlers to make your case and share that info.
Smaller Blade Relief
In reference to the post aboveā¦I never said I was thinking of going to a smaller blade for reliefā¦I just noted that I was able to paddle a bit faster with the smaller blade/high cadence than with the larger blade and slower cadence based on my GPS readings.
I actually prefer paddling the larger blade with slower cadenceā¦just realized that with my GPS I can paddle a hair faster using the faster stroke. Just was interesting to meā¦and surprsing. Again thoughā¦it may be also be a result of shaft length. I wonāt know until I do some more testing (my 215 Ikelos arrived today!)
After thinking about it some more on the drive to work today, I think that as previously suggested the blade size issue is srtictly a matter of gearing and matching the right gear to the power plant (paddler) and vehicle (boat), and RPM rate at which the engine can cycle (cadence).
My original thoughts on this subject were primarily based upon paddle lenght and having a long enough paddle to achieve a good catch as far forward as possible while still maintaing good posture.
Again, these are just some preliminary thoughts. I will have to do some more experimenting before I can make any conclusions for sureā¦conclusions that will apply for me and may or may not apply for you and your boat but hopefully will provide some food for thought.
Matt
Tried the longer paddle today
Well I got my 215 Ikelos out on the water today along with my 210 Ikelos and 210 Cyprus (which has the same shaft length as the 215 Ikelos and therefore feels the same length).
I only got an hour on the water because my Greenlander Proās seat brokeā¦againā¦but I was able to to some testing with my GPS and make some conclusions.
Using the longer Ikelos allowed me to paddle at virtually the identical speed as with 210 Cyprus (smaller bladed paddle but with more muscular exertion)when paddling at a fast exercise pace.
On the other hand the bigger bladed paddle propelled the kayak faster when paddling at what I would consider a more long-distance level of exertion.
I found that I could paddle about the same speed with the shorter Ikelos, but only if I used a very vertical stroke, more vertical than what I prefer.
So for me, I think that the longer 215 is a better paddle based upon my preferred paddling angle. I also felt like I could maintain a bit smoother form. I did not felt like I could maintain a more upright posture while still getting a good catch.
So for me, the 215 Ikelos coupled with the 210 Cyprus (both with the same shaft length) seems like a better combo than the 210 Ikelos and 205 Cyprus I had been using.
One thing I did learn is that the correct shaft length is really very much a function of the precise angle at which you prefer to paddle.
I also learned that blade size can be more efficient at some speeds than at others. It would seem that the smaller blade is more efficient for me at higher speeds and the larger blade is more efficient for me crusing speeds, or at least so it seems from my hour on the water today.
Matt
paddle blade size
When I ordered the Epic āsmall mid-wingā for my wife to use in the Yukon race, the epic staff suggested that I switch to the āsmall mid-wingā instead of the āmid-wingā that I use. For long distance there would be less stress on joints.
Sprint racers use large paddles for short distances, Marathon paddlers use smaller blades for longer distances. There is a trade off in paddle efficency vs. paddler fatigue.
I do disagree that joint stress is only caused by bad technique. The larger the blade the more resistance in the water. No matter how good your technique is, your joints and connective tissue are still involved in connecting the paddle to torso rotation. A little give = longer paddling time.