Back deck roll
I end up having this debate at least a few times a year it seems, with paddlers from all kinds of backgrounds.
The one issue with relying solely on a back deck roll, and the physical setup associated with it, is that it can leave someone with a real problem adding the ability to move their roll forward. Granted that roll will work in most stuff that people paddle in, but like everything else in kayaking there are times when it is nice to have a few more arrows in the quiver. I don’t have a storm roll yet, at least I don’t think I’ve done one that was correctly a storm roll, but one thing that is nice about that roll is that it adds a lot of flexibility in how you can get up.
I am not someone who is hard-core about the back deck rolls either for or against. And heck knows if you spend long enough out there, some are. But I do think that it’s a good comfort to be able to move the roll around a bit, and I think that defining “a best” roll may encourage too narrow an approach.
combat = fighting and death
kayaking = fun
two of my pet peeves - referring to kayaks as ‘yaks’ and using the phrase combat for anything other than actual combat.
isn’t that a ‘lay back roll’?
that terminology still bugs me…
You’re referring to an aft finishing roll or a layback roll. It’s not a backdeck roll. A backdeck roll is a forward finishing low-brace roll done with the powerside face of the paddle. A true backdeck roll is most often used by whitewater playboaters although I’ve found it to be a great roll for sea kayaking as well.
roll or die
sometimes a good kayak roll will save your life. sometimes in a kayak you need to fight to stay alive.
surf, rock gardens and whitewater can provide some of the most FUN a human can endure. it can also challenge you to the max.
if you don't like to risk that kind of exposure maybe YOU don't even need a roll. anyone who wants a kayak roll WANTS a combat roll.
sorry if the nomanclature isn't your cup o' tea.
steve
Angel or Butterfly Roll
Its the one I go to when my standard or any other type of roll fails. So easy,…though now I am sure I will be jinxed when I try it now that I said that!
Not sure how it will work in bumpy water though I am sure that not being successful gets you “angel” status anyway!
I also like that screw roll with the Kayak Roll DVD though I can only do it with a Euro paddle at the moment…
Scott
Favorite roll
I put in another vote for the West Greenland storm roll. It is easy on my back and shoulders, works in a variety of kayaks, and works for me in stormy and cold conditions.
yep
the one that works—usually a screw roll(or layback roll) for me
I prefer
using the term "screw roll" for the layback because if you blow it youre screwed plus it was what it used to be called 15 years ago when I first learned it.
Correct.
The back deck roll is the only roll I know of that can be completed witout getting your hair wet. Maybe not in a long boat.
If I were asked, “What are my favorite rolls that I can’t yet do?,” they would be the back deck roll and the G storm roll.
The back deck roll because it feels good. (Even though I can’t complete it, I like how it feels when I try.)
The storm roll because it could add some versatitily in “combat” situations.
Paul
And waveskis
Sometimes the only roll that works.
Ah Grasshopper …
You need to have some more experience tumbling with your head moving 15 mph in water moving 6" over razor sharp rocks and reefs.
You will then realize that there is no misuse of the word combat.
No 5.
Ah yes that one cracked me up.
The Youtube video roll.
What is a storm roll?
By “West Greenland Storm Roll” do you mean the one D. Hutchenson documented in his book “Eskimo Roll”? In that roll, the paddle is used in the extended position and slaps the face of the water at about 30 degrees out from the bow. I do a modified version of this with a euro paddle held in the regular position and it is very powerful.
Yeast Roll
Technique involves a stainless knife and some butter with honey in it.
Can’t go wrong with that…
jim
My technique…
…apply lots of butter and jam.
been there done that both kayaking and
actual combat. Believe me if you are in a fire fight there is no confusing that with kayaking. It is one thing to put yourself in a situation with nature, it another to put yourself in a situation where people are actively trying to kill you.
Trust me when I say they are very different things.
To Further Answer Your Question…
A boat with a lower rear deck will be easier to roll if you like Eric Jackson's 'laid back' style.
An example of a great boat to roll EJ style is the Impex Outer Island with it's very low rear deck. A not so great EJ roller would be the QCC 600... rear deck is high.
Ultimately…
it’s a mindset thing. When you recognize you are in a life or death situation, how your mind reacts determines how well you can employ whatever training, skills and physical attributes to survive the situation.
Have never been in “sanctioned” combat but I have my share of experiences with urban combat, including being shot at, faced blunt and edged tools, as well as being outnumbered. In these situations, I have always felt I have a chance in so much as it is my mindset and skills against that of the other. I may die but so can he. So who’s going to blink or falter…
Pitted against nature, it’s different in that nature doesn’t care, doesn’t falter, and is infinitely more powerful. It just is. If you underestimate and make a mistake, you can try all you can and it may just not be enough. I remember going into a class IV strainer, getting pinned, and then bodily stretched out by the current and then having my paddle stripped. That was absolutely nothing to be done about it. The only thing I could do was to simply make a quick peace and accept I was going to die. Then, I got sucked right out of the boat and went through the strainer. Guess it just wasn’t my time, not because of anything I could do, but because fate or whatever determined that I should have some more time left on this plane.
Call it what you will, a roll that may make a difference between being harmed or killed is different from a pool or flat water roll. At that point, it’s not just the skill of the person but his/her mindset in face of possible death.
That’s my take on it.
sing
Ones that work…
I find that it is very useful to have more than one roll at my command.
Depending on the conditions (mine and the water's) and the boat differing rolls have worked for me.
IMHO, there are real sound reasons for knowing more than one roll. These days my first is usually Ben Lawry's because it is compact and quick. If I fail to come up using Ben's then my fallback is often Jay's roll because I just about never fail to come up using it.
As far as production sea kayaks for rolling - the easiest I've rolled are Outer Island, Elaho DS, Romany, Nordkapp LV, Explorer.
THE easiest boat I've rolled is my wife's Dagger Piedra ;-)