I need to outfit my new Subaru Outback with a rack. I normally carry one canoe, but occasionally I carry two side by side. I intend to get two sets of bars, a shorter set for regular use and an extra-long set for those occasions when I’m carrying two boats. One important consideration is the ease of switching out shorter for longer bars. In case it matters, one of my canoes is royalex / vinyl gunwales, one is fiberglass / ash gunwales, one is kevlar / aluminum gunwales. Any reason I should prefer one manufacturer over the other? Thanks for any advice or insight.
Changing bars is not as easy as you’d probably like, since doing so also involves loosening the way the brackets mount to the car’s roof or existing rack (depending which is the case). That definitely slows things down. My solution was to use one set of Yakima bars which remain attached at all times, and also to have a completely separate set of cross bars, made from 2x4s, which clip on in a very convenient way. It’s a whole lot faster and more fool-proof than changing the Yakima cross bars, though my new system uses four bolts per connection instead of two as was the case on my older set of longer cross bars. There is a pair of lengthwise bars permanently bolted to the ends of the Yakima bars, and when I wish to have longer cross bars, I simply clip the longer set onto those lengthwise bars with U-bolts. The lengthwise bars have other advantages, being an optional means of loading boats and adding rigidity to the whole installation.
Here’s one photo that shows every necessary detail. The black-coated round bar is the permanent Yakima cross bar. The rusty steel bar is the permanent lengthwise bar. The gray 2x4 lumber with a carpet coating is the optional longer cross bar. The top of the 2x4 is just slightly higher than the top of the Yakima bar, so when it’s in place, it’s the only bearing surface for the boats.
Here’s how it looks when the longer set of bars is not installed.
And here’s a collection of photos which include some other views of this system (some showing my previous double-wide cross bars with a slightly different attachment system). If I had to start again from scratch, at least if basing the system on an aftermarket rack like Yakima or Thule, I’d use this same method. Of course, it works best with round bars.
Be sure you calculate the maximum width you need for carrying 2 canoes side by side. If you use gunwale stops be sure to add the additional width they will contribute. For example if your canoes are 36" wide and each gunwale stop adds 1.5 inches, you find you are at 39" for a single boat. 78 inches for 2. Thule square bars maximum length is 78". Yakima round bars go up to I believe 86".
Actually, gunwale stops make no difference at all, in my experience. They contact the boat at locations where the boat is much narrower than at the middle. Two canoes, side by side and only one inch apart from each other at their widest point will have something like 1.5 feet of clearance between them at the cross-bar locations, leaving plenty of space for gunwale stops. That’s assuming a reasonable distance between cross bars, but even with closely spaced bars there ought to be plenty of extra room between the boats at the bar locations. I have often carried boats so that the widest part overhung the ends of the cross bars by quite a lot, and the length of the bars was quite a bit less than the overall width of the boats.
In a pinch, you can gain several inches of width capacity by positioning one boat a couple feet behind the other, so the widest points of the two boats are not side by side. I’ve done that when necessary too, quite a lot of times (such as when carrying two canoes side by side, but with less space on one side because of also carrying a kayak, but my usual method for piggybacking a kayak positions that boat in a way that requires very little actual rack space).
@Guideboatguy said:
Actually, gunwale stops make no difference at all, in my experience. They contact the boat at locations where the boat is much narrower than at the middle. Two canoes, side by side and only one inch apart from each other at their widest point will have something like 1.5 feet of clearance between them at the cross-bar locations, leaving plenty of space for gunwale stops.
That would depend on the spread of the bars as to how much narrower it would be then at the middle. Point is to calculate total width needed, including gunwale stops (if used and if their placement adds to total width) and purchase bars of sufficient length. If width isn’t an issue then both Thule and Yakima are both very reputable companies.
Well, I hate to be picky, but I did point out the bar-spread issue and that even with closely spaced bars you’ll end up with several inches of clearance between the boats where the gunwale stops go. Besides, even without gunwale stops you need a couple of inches of bar space available to wrap your main tie-downs around, so I’m really not seeing an issue here, but yeah, the user should make sure he’s aware of what he needs.
It is easy to get two canoes on the standard 48" bar - turn them on their side. I can fit a kayak as well. Here is my Kevlar Spirit II (aluminum gunwales), whitegold Wildfire (wood gunwales) and my daughter’s kayak (I love her anyway 
).
With solo boats (you haven’t said what you have) I can do one flat and one on it’s side,
I know some people would rather not carry boats on their side, but I have never had a problem. I have also put one flat, and leaned the other against it, but I usually find it easier just to put them on their side.
Here’s one - three boats on long bars - Swift Prospector, Bell Wildfire and a Placid Rapidfire on long bars. The boats are probably worth more than the car.
I have Thule, but I don’t think it matters.
If your Subie doesn’t have a factory rack like mine, get Yakima “landing Pads” and their matching towers.
It takes me all of ten seconds to change out each cross bar.(as fast as walking around the car)
I have three sets of the 78" bars. One outfitted for canoes, one outfitted with kayak saddles and one outfitted with kayak J cradles(to carry both a canoe and two yaks).
I use Yakima “Load stops”, (cheaper and better than “gunnel brackets’” with my canoes if I am going at highway speeds.
I don’t care what any one says about them, they stop the canoe bow wiggle, (especially on a long canoe with a short rack spread), no matter how tight you have the canoe strapped down. With my 16 and 17 foot canoes I use them on the Outside of the canoe hull and on my 18’-6" racing canoe with the wood gunnels, I use them on the inside.
I also use the same racks on the cap of my pick up truck.
jack L
Many thanks for all of the great info here. Guideboatguy, you are not messing around. The occasions when I need to carry two boats are fairly rare (3-4 times/yr), so I don’t think my situation warrants that awesome rig you’ve developed. Your points about beam width are well taken, and the idea of offsetting boats on the rack is new to me. I’ll definitely try that.
Thanks for the input eckilson. I’ve experimented with leaning one boat over the other, though I haven’t tried putting them up on their sides like that. The lean technique worries me at highway speeds, and I think putting them on their sides would downright give me a panic attack. (I make no argument that this fear is based on reality.) I worry, too, about the weird strapping angles required for these arrangements, and how it affects material tolerances.
Good call on load stops vs. gunnel brackets.
All of this gives me plenty of food for thought.
My canoes are a '97 MR Independence in FG / a Bell Alaskan layed up in Royalex / and a Wenonah MN2 in Kevlar.
Thanks again.
The hull of your Kevlar boat would surely cave-in pretty significantly under the stress of being strapped down on its side, and if your fiberglass canoe is like the fiberglass boats that I have, the same would happen to it, though to a lesser degree. I prefer to strap down a canoe in a way that means there’s no “give” where it’s in contact with the cross bars or straps, and that of course means gunwales against the bars. It doesn’t sound like you need any convincing about that, though.
Westbrancher, did your Outback come with crossbars or is it the Limited model with low profile roof rails? If it’s like most Outbacks you already have a solid rack for one boat and all you need is load stops or gunnel brackets made for aero bars from Thule or Yakima to put on your Subaru crossbars (I’ve got a set of the newer low profile Yakima gunnel brackets on my Honda CRV’s Honda crossbars and I like them). Then if you like you can buy a rack with long bars for those few times when you need to carry multiple boat. Seems like you’ll need a set of gunnel brackets or load stops made for aero bars in any case so why not just try them on your stock system first?
You might check an Outback owner’s forum to see if anyone has any concern about using their stock crossbars. Your vehicle will be quieter and get better gas mileage if you can avoid adding stuff to your vehicle.
As far as which is better Yakima or Thule, both are good solid systems yet kind of pricey so I’d lean towards whichever one I could find used on craigslist.
@Westbrancher said:
I’ve experimented with leaning one boat over the other, though I haven’t tried putting them up on their sides like that. The lean technique worries me at highway speeds, and I think putting them on their sides would downright give me a panic attack.
I agree that leaning one boat on another isn’t particularly stable - mostly because the straps now need to go over two boats. By putting boats on their side you can strap each boat down individually - much sturdier. I worry less that way.
@Guideboatguy said:
The hull of your Kevlar boat would surely cave-in pretty significantly under the stress of being strapped down on its side, and if your fiberglass canoe is like the fiberglass boats that I have, the same would happen to it, though to a lesser degree.
Nope - you might think that, but it doesn’t. I had my Kevlar Spirit II on its side for the two hour drive down to our beach house - no problem. Same thing with my whitegold Wildfire. I did tie the bow and stern carefully - wouldn’t want them rocking up and down in the wind.
With a Royalex boat I wouldn’t hesitate for a minute to tie it on its side.
Hmmm. On all Kevlar boats I’ve seen, which is about two dozen, including the Merlin II that I own, it’s a simple matter to deflect the side of the hull a couple inches inward simply by pushing against the outside surface with the palm of one’s hand. On my fiberglass boats, the flat sidewalls of the hull can easily be pushed in about half an inch, again with nothing but hand pressure. Parking the boat sideways against a fallen tree in light current will do the same - I’ve seen that plenty of times while so parked. I know plenty of people who would not notice such a thing, and I bet that would describe you. There’s nothing wrong with that. People vary in how they notice things like that and whether they care.
The bottom of such boats is normally a lot stiffer, both due to the curvature and due to a foam core or foam ribs, and if the contact with the cross bar is shared between the curved chine and the gunwale, there may well be no noticeable deflection, and I suspect if there really is no deflection you are not noticing that the hull itself is actually spared the full contact force for this reason. I’d still shy away from doing that due to the great complexity of fixing a dented skin over a foam core.
If the hull deflects, I’m not saying this will wreck the boat, but for someone who doesn’t want their boat to have a temporary dent when cinched down on the cross bar of their rack, this is something they would want to consider.
In any case, push on the relatively flat sidewalls of the composite boats you mentioned, and see if you don’t see obvious deflection.
Oh, and regarding Royalex boats, if it’s a beater boat, no problem, but on one that’s relatively pristine and dent-free, I still wouldn’t tie it sideways on the cross bars. Some of the dents in my Royalex boats simply happened from laying them on rocky ground, and that’s just from the weight of the boat itself plus a little gear inside, not with the added, much greater force of a tie-down strap. Royalex gets permanent dents in the outer surface (not all the way through) very easily, but on a beater whitewater boat, you’d not likely notice.
GBG - I’m not saying that there is absolutely no hull deflection if you strap down a boat on its side - there is, and it was more noticeable on the Kevlar Spirit II than on my other boats. But your original comment was that a “Kevlar boat would surely cave-in pretty significantly under the stress of being strapped down on its side”, and that is not the case. I have done it multiple times on relatively long trips, and the boats are fine - no dents, no cracks, no permanent damage. The straps were firm, but not tight enough to deform the hull. With a little lighter pressure on the straps, bow and stern lines are especially important.
The OP was looking for ways to occasionally carry multiple canoes - longer bars are one option, putting them on their side is another. The MNII is even longer than my Spirit II, but I still think you could do it (low speed, short trip). I wouldn’t think twice about putting the Independence or the Alaskan on their side. Or he can just get longer bars…
Looking at your pictures, your boats are beautiful - not a dent or a scratch. Mine have plenty of both that I attribute to rocky New England streams, but maybe there is a difference in attitude as well.
Another simple way to make your bars longer is to do what I did one time when I wanted to carry four boats.
If you have Yakima round bars: A length of 1/2 " rigid iron pipe slides perfectly into the Yakima bars.
Slide a eight foot length through and cut it to the length you want and then use one pipe strap clamp on each side up against the Yakima bar to hold it from moving.
It works like a charm.
Just be careful going through drive through windows !
Jack L
Thanks, TomL. Here’s a picture of my Outback’s roof. I think these bars are the ones you’re calling “low profile.” They’re generally pretty awful for car-topping a canoe. For my beamier boats, they leave too little clearance on either side to work with straps/ropes. My intention is to remove these bars and replace with the after-market rack.
@Westbrancher said:
Thanks, TomL. Here’s a picture of my Outback’s roof. I think these bars are the ones you’re calling “low profile.” They’re generally pretty awful for car-topping a canoe. For my beamier boats, they leave too little clearance on either side to work with straps/ropes. My intention is to remove these bars and replace with the after-market rack.
Bummer, no room for straps. Really a shame given that your stock crossbars have a nice long front to rear spread…hopefully you can maintain that spread with an aftermarket system. I hope one of the other recommendations works for you.
Some Yakima round bars have a lengthwise ridge down the inside that prevents using 1/2" pipe for an extension.
Lesson learned the hard way - do not count on shuttling with untested galvanized pipe Yakima rack extensions on the take-out vehicle! Making last minute shuttle plans for a local paddle, I bought galvanized pipe and before leaving the Home Depot parking lot verified that the pipe was the right size to fit inside the 78" Yakima bars which were on my vehicle. A friend and I proceeded to paddle, taking my vehicle to the put-in and leaving his vehicle at the take-out. After arriving at the take-out and trying to install the pipe extensions we found that his Yakima bars had internal ridges that made it impossible to insert the pipe.
@JackL said:
Another simple way to make your bars longer is to do what I did one time when I wanted to carry four boats.
If you have Yakima round bars: A length of 1/2 " rigid iron pipe slides perfectly into the Yakima bars.
Slide a eight foot length through and cut it to the length you want and then use one pipe strap clamp on each side up against the Yakima bar to hold it from moving.
It works like a charm.
Just be careful going through drive through windows !Jack L
I have a Yakima extension that I use for loading and unloading.