I’m looking for a sit in kayak to use where the Housatanic river meets long island sound… there is a nature preserve with calm water across the river from where I live, but crossing the river can be choppy. I am relatively new to kayaking so want something stable but that tracks well. I am female, 5’9 and about 175 lbs.
I have been looking for a used kayak and found these 2 ads on craigslist… any opinions on which is the better kayak? Any key questions to ask the sellers? Are the prices fair?
14.5 perception shadow sea touring kayak - $800
used perception shadow touring kayak; blue, rudder, thigh braces, includes skirt. This boat is AWESOME, but I’m moving to freshwater lake
Wilderness System Tsunami 140 Red in excellent condition, purchase new June 2009,with Seal Coastal Tour Sprayskirt just purchased this year, kayak has phase 3 seating system, slidelock foot brace system, adjustable padded thigh braces, bow and stern bulkheads, rudder ready, always stored inside $850
That is a tough question for anyone,
to answer unless they have had both boats.
My wife has a Perception Shadow, but it is the original one that is 16’-8".
A few years later they started making the Shadow, Eclipse and the Carolina in all different lengths.
for what it is worth, even though she now paddles a QCC, she won’t part with the Shadow, and she races it in rocky down river races a few times a year.
Hopefully you’ get someone to answer you that has had both boats.
Jack L
If only you could try them out…
I have a kayak tours biz and use the Tsunami 140 almost every day. Next to a Romany and Tempest 165, the Tsunami 140 is my clients’ favorite kayak. It would fit you well and it is a stable, comfortable craft that won’t let you down in the conditions you mention. The guy I got it from used it for years, loved it and now paddles an Impex Montauk. He swears that if anything ever happens to the Impex, he wants the Tsunmami back!
I’ve used the Shadow and find it a little faster, not as comfortable. Make sure the rudder cables are in good shape before you depend on the rudder.
spec and reviews aside,
the better boat is the one that fits you, you feel comfortable in and makes you smile. Some time on the water can answer that. Please try before you buy. Initial tippiness sensation will fade quickly after some experience. Tracking is affected by stroke technique as well as hull design.
Many like the adjustable P3 seating. Often, adding or removing foam at knee and thigh contact points to hull can make a huge improvement. Is one boat easier to manage off the water getting on/off car or trailer? Are they equal with regard to storage space.
Once you choose, paddle often, enjoy your new boat and seek out some guidance and company from other paddlers and local clubs. Remain aware there are few absolutes. If it works for you then great.
Andy gave the perfect answer…
see if you can try them out. Each are good…it comes down what you are pleased with currently.
my GF loves her Tsunami 140
FWIW. And she is comfortable in it when the lakes get choppy and in Class II. I see the one you found is “rudder ready.” My GF does use her rudder when the wind picks up. (Yeah, try both if you can!) MY GF bought hers after demoing it (and a couple of others).
Shadow
I owned a 16.8’ Shadow and it was a pretty nice boat. The sleek lines and fast rounded hull got me through the water quickly, but that same hull also weather-cocked and felt tippy for my weight (185 lbs). I’ve borrowed the Tsunami and it felt slower, but more stable and comfortable. It’s also a newer model with tougher, but also probably heavier plastic. Both are used in rental fleets, but the Shadow has been phased out years ago. As much as I miss my Shadow, $800 is a bit much for an old plastic boat that needs a keel stiffening pole. Ultimately, you’ll be better off if you can try both out first.
I absolutely agree with those
suggesting you try before you buy.
Due to arm, leg, torso, and style of paddling, the same boat can feel different to each person. Some may say they’ve had good luck with a specific boat and want no other, but you will ride different boats differently. There are no two persons alike in their needs.
I am 5’2", like a lower front, cockpit height than the Tsanami, prefer a narrower boat, or one I can place my thighs under the edge should it not have thigh braces.
Thanks to all who continue to share their personal expertise and recommending that folks, especially newbies, “try before you buy”. It’s so sad to see some purchase a boat before trying and become discouraged because it doesn’t fit them enough to be able to enjoy their time on the water.
Listen to the voices of experience. It can save you money, time, and perhaps giving up a great sport. There is a boat out there you can be one with on the water.
Happy paddling.
The Shadow 14.5 may be a bit small
for you.
I tried out a composite Shadow 14.5 this summer and it was snug, but acceptable for me at 5’6" and 160 lbs. It had SmartTrak rudder controls and was really quite nice for me to paddle. If the price had been more reasonable, I would have bought it, but I couldn’t make the deal.
Try it out.
I’ve never paddled any Tsunami.
Tsunami…
As others have said…try them both out. But I will add that I have a Tsunami 140 and I love it!
Found out the perception is 10 years old
Found out the perception is 10 years old, so the price definitely seems high…
How do you coordinate trying them when it’s a private seller?
A couple of things
Paddle folks are usually amenable to your trying the boat out, at least the decent ones. You just may have to coordinate your timing so they can be with you. Personally I wouldn’t send someone I didn’t know off in one of my boats without being there in case they capsize or whatever.
That said, I keep thinking that you’d be better off with the Tsunami 140.
agree with Celia and others.
Keeping in mind that try before you buy is preferred, the Tsunami is still in production, easy to find parts for, and an excellent boat to paddle. I paddle a Tsunami in your area, and they are readily available in CT at EMS, and several outfitters, so parts are easy to get if something happens. Dave at CT Outdoors in Oakville has them for rent, and for sale at a good price. He’s a good guy and will help you out if you need it. The price of the other boat is out of whack for a 10 year old plastic boat out of production. Offer 600 cash for the Tsunami package and you’ll have made a Really good purchase.
I agree on the Tsunami
One of my paddling buddies is your size and she loves her Tsunami – much better deal than the other yak, too, though both are priced a bit high – I would offer $700 for the Tsunami and be happy to settle for $750. With that skirt it was over $1000 new.
I doubt you’ll need the rudder initially. I’ve paddled in your area – in fact, over 10 years of kayaking I have to say one of my favorite day trips of all time was paddling down the Housie (we put in at an arched stone bridge a couple miles upstream), wandering the salt marsh maze of the delta (flushed a flock of 9 great white egrets at one point), around the Sound a bit and then back upstream after dark under a full moon, stopping at a dock to get dinner at a quite good restaurant before take out back at the bridge. I was using a somewhat beamy Feathercraft folding kayak w/o even a skeg and had no problems with the river crossings or even out in the Sound. Once you get confident enough for more open water touring you can decide if you need the rudder.
Tsunamis are versatile, proven boats and, as others have said, a model for which you will have no trouble getting parts and accessories for a long time. And they hold their value if you ever decide to upgrade to more “exotic” kayak.
Tsunami
I don’t know much about the Shadow, but I can tell you from personal experience with my own Tsunami 120 that the Tsunami is an ideal boat for what you describe you will use it for, and your size. It will give the confidence you need to start and give you room to grow.
Based on hearing the age of the Shadow the Tsunami is a much better choice in my opinion.
For a one year old Tsunami 140 I think the price is pretty good.
Keep looking
I’m a little smaller than you, and I would not buy either of these boats or any other 14 ft boat. You will be happier with a regular size sea kayak, 16-17 ft, since you are not small. Too big a person in too snall a boat = very slow.
The versatile Tsunami
We’ve got two Tsunami kayaks in our family. Although I have “outgrown” them in some ways, I must say that they are clearly the best-of-breed in the light touring class. A lot has already been said about their stability and versatility – and I can only second that. What doesn’t often get mentioned is how well they do in “conditions.” While they are not really meant for rough open ocean conditions, and they are rather slow in such waters, they WILL get you through it all with confidence. When I am out with my paddling buddies (who are in sleeker full-on sea kayaks) they will be nervously trying to stay upright while I just have a blast barreling into the waves with little concern for tipping over. Again, the Tsunamis are not meant for those conditions like a real “play boats” – but they are dependable when you have to get through rougher stuff unexpectedly. I definitely think the Tsunami is for you.
The 140 is not “slow”
For her size. She's just about ideal weight for it. We got a guy paddling one on our regular outings alongside all sorts of other "long" kayaks and he's got no problem keeping-up. Unless we really pull hard and then of course he falls behin, but that's nearly race pace that most folks do not do on regular outings.
I personally paddle several kayaks and the one I paddled most over the past couple of years is a Perception Sonoma 13.5, which as the name suggests is under 14 feet with no more than 12.5 feet waterline. I'm 180lb so a little heavy for it but still I've never had a problem keeping-up with others, even at a brisk pace (but I do work harder when they try to go moer than 4.5 mph and about 4.7 average over 10-15 miles flat water is about the max I can do in it at a very brisk pace). 5mph average in that boat is barely achievable over 5 miles distance but that's exhausting.
On the other hand the boat is a blast to have in "conditions" and moving water and lately that's what I use it for mostly.
I would agree with you that a 14-16 footer will be better if one is going for mostly faster pace paddles over longer distances, but for group outings where people have mixed skills I don't see the 14 footer as a limitation at all.
boat choices
both will make a good beginner’s boat. That’s no way intended as a slam at you or the boats.
When new to kayaking it’s good for most to start w. a reassuring boat. Depending on your interest in developing skills you might move on to a different kayak, in fact your probably will.
So in that case your goat s/be to get on the water w. something that is stable and good in the condiitons that you are paddling in at present.
It was not me, but a seasoned ouitfitter, who called the Eclipse “the rec boat of seakayaks” by which he meant they are stable, easy to enter and exit, and easy fof beginners to use… and that’s a good thing!
The Tsunami series has many pluses and are deservedly popular. One downside is the their width and cockpit depth make skills like more aggressive bracing, and eventually rolling (if you’re headed that way) more difficult. The Eclipse, while still generous in beam (hull width )and cockpit dimensions, is a bit friendlier to those skills.
Being a female you already have a lower Center of Gravits… that COG means you can handle boats that others find “tippier.” So as Survivor says, try some others… you may be pleasantly surprised that you can handle a more “advanced” boat t han either the Eclipse or this Tsunami… Which means a boat that lets you do more and that you’ll enjoy longer.
If either boat feels totally stable to you, you’ll like be bored w. it by next season if not the end of this one - assuming you use it regularly and want to keep on learning.
The prices are fair for both boats. Wouldn’t call either a steal of a deal.Sellers set prices a bit higher and expect you to make an offer (you prolly know this, but sometimes new kayakers jump quickly and buy at asking price) so go ahead, demo each one, and offer lower… and save even more $$ for a very good paddle and comfortable pfd 
but I agree w. Survivor, try a bunch more boats by different makers.
If you like plastic or need it for reasons of hard use or price, consider used Necky Chathams (a 160 or 170), Valley Skerrays or Avocets, Hurricane Aquasports Tampico 140L or the Tracer 165)… what about a vintgage Necky Elaho DS or a plastic P&H Capella 166? Plastic Tempests (155 and 170) abound. You can find all of these between $800 and $1000 and may do even better w. discontinued but worthy models like the Valley Skerray (an awesome plastic seakayak I highly reocmmend, along w. the plastic Valley Avocet and the P&H Capella 166).
You may find an Eddyline Nighthawk, a sixteen footer with nice roomy lines, light weight in theremoformed plastic, and great performance, for $1000- $1200. Another well regareded boat. like the Avocets, Capellas and and Tempests, they are well regarded by beginning and seasoned kayakers.
These are just top of mind suggestions. Look around, there are others.
There are plenty of Tsunami around, and plenty of Perception seakayaks (the Eclipse, the Essence, etc). If these sell another will come along.
boat choices
both will make a good beginner’s boat. That’s no way intended as a slam at you or the boats.
When new to kayaking it’s good for most to start w. a reassuring boat. Depending on your interest in developing skills you might move on to a different kayak, in fact your probably will.
So in that case your goat s/be to get on the water w. something that is stable and good in the condiitons that you are paddling in at present.
Both boats are what are called “transitional” or “daytourers” - marketing terms, yes, but taken generally to mean somewhere betw. a recreational boat and a full on seakayak in outfitting and performance.
That’s often a good place for a beginner. I do know a few folks who started right in at seakayaks, tho, and never looked back.
The Tsunami series has many pluses and are deservedly popular. So is the Perception model.One downside is the their width and cockpit depth make skills like more aggressive bracing, and eventually rolling (if you’re headed that way) more difficult.
Being a female you already have a lower Center of Gravits… that COG means you can handle narrower boats that others find “tippy.” By narrower I mean much less than 23-25 inches, which is where most transitional boat beams lie.
So as Survivor says, try some others… you may be pleasantly surprised that you can handle a more “advanced” boat than either of these… Which means a boat that lets you do more and that you’ll enjoy longer.
If either boat feels totally stable to you, you’ll like be bored w. it by next season if not the end of this one - assuming you use it regularly and want to keep on learning.
The prices are fair for both boats. Wouldn’t call either a steal of a deal.Sellers set prices a bit higher and expect you to make an offer (you prolly know this, but sometimes new kayakers jump quickly and buy at asking price) so go ahead, demo each one, and offer lower… and save even more $$ for a very good paddle and comfortable pfd
but I agree w. Survivor, try a bunch more boats by different makers.
my admitted bias is seakayaks (16 feet or longer, fully outfitted boats for big water). A wise coach of mine once said… “you can paddle a boat down to conditions, but you usually cannot paddle a boat up”
If you like plastic or need it for reasons of hard use or price, consider used Necky Chathams (a 160 or 170), Valley Skerrays or Avocets, Hurricane Aquasports Tampico 140L or the Tracer 165)… what about a vintgage Necky Elaho DS or a plastic P&H Capella 166? Plastic Tempests (155 and 170) abound. You can find all of these between $800 and $1000 and may do even better w. discontinued but worthy models like the Valley Skerray.
You may find an Eddyline Nighthawk, a sixteen footer with nice roomy lines, light weight in theremoformed plastic, and great performance, for $1000- $1200. Another well regareded boat. like the Avocets, Capellas and and Tempests, they are well regarded by beginning and seasoned kayakers.
These are just top of mind suggestions. Look around, there are others.
There are plenty of Tsunami around, and plenty of Perceptions. If these sell another will come along.