All - my intent was not to start a debate about cost/safety. I’ve gotten everything from “you get what you pay for” to “major highway accidents” to “use foam blocks and some straps”.
It seems that the most reasonable and safest might just be to buy the aero crossbars from Subaru since they’re factory designed to fit the car properly (safest), are rated well above the weight of even two kayaks and can accommodate Thule J-cradles. Then either hit the gym and work on upper body or come up with a DIY method to get it up into the cradles without damaging the car or boat.
@willowleaf said:
Bit of trivia here: if you opt for extra long bars on your roof system so that you have extra room for multiple and/or wider boats, be aware that you will poke yourself in the eye or whatever body part comes level with those ends that extend past the footprint of the vehicle.
Thankfully one problem a 5’6" guy with a Sienna does not have. The bars stick out above my head level. And they are handy to grab on when stepping up.
@wgb113 said:
All - my intent was not to start a debate about cost/safety. I’ve gotten everything from “you get what you pay for” to “major highway accidents” to “use foam blocks and some straps”.
It seems that the most reasonable and safest might just be to buy the aero crossbars from Subaru since they’re factory designed to fit the car properly (safest), are rated well above the weight of even two kayaks and can accommodate Thule J-cradles. Then either hit the gym and work on upper body or come up with a DIY method to get it up into the cradles without damaging the car or boat.
Hitting a gym? I lift weights and can pretty safely assume that I can lift more than an average guy in my weight category. Loading a 17 feet 50 pound surfski on top of a minivan is still 100% out of question. On the other hand I once had a 5’9" skinny guy lift up the same ski over his head and load it on j-racks on my van. So, if anything you should do balance excercises with your boat . But to me the cost of an error is still too high. If I drop my boat from the top the cost of body work will easily exceed the price of the Malone setup I got
@willowleaf said:
be aware that you will poke yourself in the eye or whatever body part comes level with those ends that extend past the footprint of the vehicle. The rack companies should make bar end “bumpers” for this.
It only took couple times smacking my skull off the corner of my extended bars before I began habitual exaggerated ducking upon entry.
@SpaceSputnik said:
I recently purchased Malone AutoLoader and Malone Telos loading guides. It is not a Hullavator,…
When I bought this device, the suction cups left dents in my car. Maybe the suction cups are bigger now.
I understand that this is about where you place them. The instructions say to place right below a crease in a bodywork as those are stronger areas. Of course if you can find an area like that. Also, it probably depends on an angle at which the guides are. In my case there is very little force pushing into the sheet metal.
Anyway, obviously a lot depends on the geometry of a vehicle.
The suction cups are pretty large.
Subaru Forester XT 2010. Same height and side rails as the new model. Malone Universal Crossbars $99.00 on Amazon. Thule Glide and Set Cradles… more expensive but used REI 20% coupon.
Easy to load kayaks from rear of vehicle, up to 85 pounds. Cradles prevent any lateral slip, and position kayaks perfectly. The only other addition was a piece of clear tape to prevent scratches on spoiler for the times I needed to open the hatch after kayak loaded.
I’ve used this setup for ten years, year round. Last year I sprung for new hardware from Thule as I was worried about rust/weakening.
Oh, I added Malone crossbar pads on one side of bars to carry a second kayak or paddle board. The pads cost $30 and work fine for kayaks, although I prefer cradles for secure hold.
@willowleaf said:
be aware that you will poke yourself in the eye or whatever body part comes level with those ends that extend past the footprint of the vehicle. The rack companies should make bar end “bumpers” for this.
It only took couple times smacking my skull off the corner of my extended bars before I began habitual exaggerated ducking upon entry.
My bar extender peeled a chunk of my forehead off the first time I ran into it. I put some padding on it and wrapped it with Gorilla Tape. Hasn’t gotten me since.
@abz said:
Subaru Forester XT 2010. Same height and side rails as the new model. Malone Universal Crossbars $99.00 on Amazon. Thule Glide and Set Cradles… more expensive but used REI 20% coupon.
Easy to load kayaks from rear of vehicle, up to 85 pounds. Cradles prevent any lateral slip, and position kayaks perfectly. The only other addition was a piece of clear tape to prevent scratches on spoiler for the times I needed to open the hatch after kayak loaded.
I’ve used this setup for ten years, year round. Last year I sprung for new hardware from Thule as I was worried about rust/weakening.
Oh, I added Malone crossbar pads on one side of bars to carry a second kayak or paddle board. The pads cost $30 and work fine for kayaks, although I prefer cradles for secure hold.
Thanks! What width Malone bar did you go with? I see Thule sells a waterslide mat the might help protect the paint as well.
. I’ll buy the stuff if I have to, but I will never say “you get what you pay for” because that isn’t remotely close to being true.
I have to disagree with you there. Quality and warranty counts. As an example, Thule and Kokatat are more expensive up front, but their products are high quality and they back them with their warranty.
To me, multiplying the cost of the stock items by as much as ten times that of the already-profitable retail cost from any reasonable source is not necessary just to pay for warranty service. They do it because they can.
Except your not running a business when you’re at a hardware store buying pipe.
I will try to make this even more simple. Nothing about what I said implies that Yakima should be buying their pipe from a hardware store. They should do exactly as any business that size would do, which is to get the stuff wholesale by the truckload (at far less cost than the retail prices I suggested using as a reference for the finished product). I’m only saying that, regardless of where they get it, adding a coating of plastic to the outside surface (probably at pennies per lineal foot) does NOT increase the pipe’s retail value by a factor of several times.
. I’ll buy the stuff if I have to, but I will never say “you get what you pay for” because that isn’t remotely close to being true.
I have to disagree with you there. Quality and warranty counts. As an example, Thule and Kokatat are more expensive up front, but their products are high quality and they back them with their warranty.
To me, multiplying the cost of the stock items by as much as ten times that of the already-profitable retail cost from any reasonable source is not necessary just to pay for warranty service. They do it because they can.
Except your not running a business when you’re at a hardware store buying pipe.
I will try to make this even more simple. Nothing about what I said implies that Yakima should be buying their pipe from a hardware store. They should do exactly as any business that size would do, which is to get the stuff wholesale by the truckload (at far less cost than the retail prices I suggested using as a reference for the finished product). I’m only saying that, regardless of where they get it, adding a coating of plastic to the outside surface (probably at pennies per lineal foot) does NOT increase the pipe’s retail value by a factor of several times.
Depends what it’s coated with? More cost to them being in business than a coated pipe. Some plastics roast up in the sun fast. Great if people make their own and are happy.
@abz said:
Subaru Forester XT 2010. Same height and side rails as the new model. Malone Universal Crossbars $99.00 on Amazon. Thule Glide and Set Cradles… more expensive but used REI 20% coupon.
Easy to load kayaks from rear of vehicle, up to 85 pounds. Cradles prevent any lateral slip, and position kayaks perfectly. The only other addition was a piece of clear tape to prevent scratches on spoiler for the times I needed to open the hatch after kayak loaded.
I’ve used this setup for ten years, year round. Last year I sprung for new hardware from Thule as I was worried about rust/weakening.
Oh, I added Malone crossbar pads on one side of bars to carry a second kayak or paddle board. The pads cost $30 and work fine for kayaks, although I prefer cradles for secure hold.
Thanks! What width Malone bar did you go with? I see Thule sells a waterslide mat the might help protect the paint as well.
On the Forester, I use 50” crossbars. I also bought a set of 78” bars that I used on my wife’s Honda Pilot.
I liked Malone as the locks are integrated… and no extra charge.
@wgb113
Hit the gym? I am 66 yrs old and stand 5 ft 3.5 inches. Weigh a healthy BMI. I have to stay in shape to do what I want, but I am what I am complete with aging back. For that reason I would not touch Jbars, instead glide pads, rollers or stackers to make it less fussy to load the boat. Solo loading for me.
Also question the additional bucks for the aero bars. Square is quiet enough in most cars and less fussy w/r to whta you put on them.
. I’ll buy the stuff if I have to, but I will never say “you get what you pay for” because that isn’t remotely close to being true.
I have to disagree with you there. Quality and warranty counts. As an example, Thule and Kokatat are more expensive up front, but their products are high quality and they back them with their warranty.
To me, multiplying the cost of the stock items by as much as ten times that of the already-profitable retail cost from any reasonable source is not necessary just to pay for warranty service. They do it because they can.
Except your not running a business when you’re at a hardware store buying pipe.
I will try to make this even more simple. Nothing about what I said implies that Yakima should be buying their pipe from a hardware store. They should do exactly as any business that size would do, which is to get the stuff wholesale by the truckload (at far less cost than the retail prices I suggested using as a reference for the finished product). I’m only saying that, regardless of where they get it, adding a coating of plastic to the outside surface (probably at pennies per lineal foot) does NOT increase the pipe’s retail value by a factor of several times.
Depends what it’s coated with? More cost to them being in business than a coated pipe. Some plastics roast up in the sun fast. Great if people make their own and are happy.
Well, you totally missed the point and also inferred one point that was never even mentioned, but so it goes. For me, when there are loads of examples in the realm of marketable products to show what’s a reasonable markup on components made of everyday materials, and then we have this example where the markup is unusually high because in this case the market allows it, it’s okay to simply acknowledge that in a case like this, free-market products are priced much higher than can be explained by “you get what you pay for.” Making up your mind that it’s not possible isn’t a very good argument to the contrary.
. But to me the cost of an error is still too high. If I drop my boat from the top the cost of body work will easily exceed the price of the Malone setup I got 
