Cut out/replace OEM "hatch"

So I have the Pelican Trailblazer 100 rec kayak (angler edition). Obviously, with such a cheap, small boat, there are no bulkheads and there is no real waterproof storage. There is one storage “hatch” on the rear deck, but it is basically a bowl with a loose-fitting cover. The storage hatch is just a well that is molded into the rear deck. It is about half the depth of the kayak, if even. It has a lid held down by bungee cord, but there is no gasket or any other mechanism to keep water out. Any water that splashes on the deck can easily trickle down into the storage hatch.



What I’m trying to figure out is if there is a way to replace the OEM storage hatch with a real one that will provide a decent amount of waterproof storage. There is no way to add a bulkhead to this kayak as the seat is molded into the boat and blocks any access to the area under the rear deck. Would I be able to cut out the OEM hatch and replace it with one of those deck plates with an integrated dry bag of some sort?

Dry bags
http://tinyurl.com/n7ykepw



Since you’re not going on any overnight expeditions, a couple of large (two gallon) freezer Ziplock bags would also work. Just double bag your stuff.



My philosophy is the less time futzing around on land equals more time on the water, especially with winter approaching.



Also, think about getting some sort of flotation in the bow. This is what can happen if the boat flips (the kid in it is beyond all help):

http://viralfury.com/dude-sinking-in-kayak-is-beyond-classic/

huge amount of work
May be possible, but costly and a huge amount of work. You’d have to find a hatch and rim that is larger than the opening you currently have. Check out Sealect Designs, as they sell hatch kits. Truthfully, it likely would be better to sell this and buy a different boat that already has them built in. A boat with a bulkhead and sealed compartment is also safer, so that is an added benefit, particularly if you are paddling in areas where water is splashing on your back deck to fill that hatch.



A cheaper solution is to use dry bags with your current setup. You can probably stuff a few in front of your feet. And maybe add a hatch or opening on the back to allow you to access the area behind your seat.

Dry bags…
Yep, with your replies and poking around the internet search sites a bit more, definitely looks like it will be cheaper and easier to just use dry bags stuffed in the bow rather than trying to retrofit a new storage hatch.



Some day in the distant future, I’ll probably get to upgrade to a quality boat with all the fixin’s and trimmin’s. But for now, I’m trying to make do with my starter boat while I continue to learn about paddling.



I’m going to see what I can do about adding some flotation bags.

doesn’t have to be fancy
Anything fairly sturdy that inflates will fill the space and displace water. You could use a large beach ball or inflatable kiddie float toy that was somewhat larger and near the shape of the hull area. As you inflate anything it will shape to the area it is constricted to. You can also get some of those hard foam “pool noodles” and cut lengths and bundle them together with duct tape to fill in under the hull. You need to thread cord through them to tie them in because both noodles and inflatables will tend to want to pop out of the boat after a capsize due to their buoyancy.



Even those of us with higher quality boats usually put our stuff in soft dry bags before stashing it in gasketed hatches, since they will often leak a bit. I have one very handy one that has a window so I can see what is in it and it has a wide mouth screw lid instead of a roll down closure – I use it for things like my camera or snacks that I want quick access to, and keep it stashed near my feet or behind the seat.



I have a skin on frame kayak with no hatches and no bulkheads and these are some solutions I’ve used.

doesn’t have to be fancy
Anything fairly sturdy that inflates will fill the space and displace water. You could use a large beach ball or inflatable kiddie float toy that was somewhat larger and near the shape of the hull area. As you inflate anything it will shape to the area it is constricted to. You can also get some of those hard foam “pool noodles” and cut lengths and bundle them together with duct tape to fill in under the hull. You need to thread cord through them to tie them in because both noodles and inflatables will tend to want to pop out of the boat after a capsize due to their buoyancy.



Even those of us with higher quality boats usually put our stuff in soft dry bags before stashing it in gasketed hatches, since they will often leak a bit. I have one very handy one that has a window so I can see what is in it and it has a wide mouth screw lid instead of a roll down closure – I use it for things like my camera or snacks that I want quick access to, and keep it stashed near my feet or behind the seat.



I have a skin on frame kayak with no hatches and no bulkheads and these are some solutions I’ve used.

Flotation vs. storage

– Last Updated: Oct-29-14 5:11 PM EST –

The OEM hatch/well that's molded into the rear deck is pretty much only good to stow small items that you don't care if they get wet or small items in a dry bag. That's what I'm using it for now. I have some smaller safety items in a small dry bag stowed in the hatch. It really isn't good for much else.

Would there be any merit in cutting out the OEM hatch just so I could access the stern area and stuff it full of flotation? Then seal off the hole somehow? Or would that be more work and expense than any benefit I'd get out of it? There's no other way to access the stern area behind the seat, and it's basically just empty space back there as far as I can tell.

Is there foam in back?

– Last Updated: Oct-30-14 7:43 AM EST –

I couldn't find this boat on Pelican's own web site so I can't tell. But is would not be unusual for there to be something like a foam block in back that would serve as some level of flotation. Maybe someone at Dick's would know, since it might be a product made specifically for them.

Honestly though, you can probably get as much going towards more boat by paying serious attention to Craig's list as by messing with this one.

You are not the first to think of this
I have two pelicans in the fleet with that hatch and had a similiar idea and several others posters have come up with he same idea over the last couple years. No one that I know of has gone through with it. One problem would be finding the right stuff to seal the hole back up. Those rings with the attached dry bag could work for some really small items. I would also suggest looking into a deck bag.

As to secondary flotation, are you taking that boat where you need it? If your in good enough shape to drag your boat ashore where you paddle then don’t worry about. If you think you do need secondary flotation then consider putting some money towards a boat with two bulkheads or a SOT.

Someone at Dick’s would know
Oh man, I hurt myself. That’s funny.

Not doing any rough paddling…

– Last Updated: Oct-29-14 10:48 PM EST –

Pirate, I will not be taking this kayak into any kind of rough waters where there's a serious risk of capsizing and really needing the secondary flotation. All the paddling I do is on small, flat, slow-moving water where I could very easily get to shore if needed.

The main reason I brought up the possibility of opening the rear deck to add flotation is because so many people keep advising me to add additional flotation to my boat. It seems like everytime I post a question about my kayak, one or more people always reply that what I should really consider is adding flotation bags or some other type of secondary flotation in the bow/stern. This must be really important if so many people are constantly advising me to do so.

I have a Sea to Summit deck bag I picked up at REI a while ago. I like it for keeping snacks, cameras, and other small items close at hand. The problem is that now that it is getting colder out, I also picked up a spray skirt for my boat to help keep cold wind and cold paddle splashes out of the cockpit. With the spray skirt on, I cannot attach the deck bag anywhere that I could reach without the spray skirt popping off. So, I don't use the deck bag when it's colder and I'm using the spray skirt.

So, I was looking at options for trying to make the rear hatch useable for storing items I want to keep dry and relatively close at hand. However, it sounds like it's going to be a bigger pain than it's worth trying to retrofit it. Besides, it's not the easiest thing to turn around and reach anyway, especially with the spray skirt on.

Celia, no idea about any foam in the stern area. I know there are foam blocks on either side of the seat, but I have no way to see into the rear area behind the seat to check there.

And, unfortunately, due to circumstances, I am stuck with the kayak I have now. At least for the short term. Maybe in a couple years I can talk my way into an upgrade, but that's not even a remote possibility at the moment. For now, I'm just nickel and diming my boat into something that's comfortable and fun to use. There will be lots of MacGyvering and small "stealth" purchases until such a time I get the green light to upgrade to a better boat.

Had an idea - thought better of it.

– Last Updated: Oct-29-14 10:51 PM EST –

I just deleted a post describing a quick and dirty way to do this, but then came to realize that this boat sounds like it must be a sit-on-top, so leakage around the joint between the hull and your home-built storage compartment would be a bad thing, and it's sure not worth wasting the time figuring out a way to seal that joint (as Pirate already has pointed out). Strapping a dry bag to the deck seems like a logical short-term solution.

Paddle and enjoy
You had mentioned in another thread you are paddling a calm, slow moving river which for the most part is shallow. From what I can tell about your kayak from the Pelican site, it has a 28" beam. That’s pretty wide and stable.



I started out this summer with a 10.5 rec kayak with a 29" beam (one bulkhead, foam flotation in the bow). We newbies tend to buy fat, squat boats. Thanks to the good advice given here, as well as lessons learned paddling that kayak, I now have boat that’s much more suitable for the lakes I paddle.



Winter is on its way - I’m across the “pond” from you, up north, and snow is forecast here tomorrow. You’ve got the cold weather clothing gear, so just go out and paddle. Work on a good forward stroke, learn, and enjoy yourself.



If and when the thoughts of another kayak enter your mind, check out the Chicago Craigslist. You can save a ton of money and if you have any questions about a particular boat, just post them here. You’ll get lots of great advice.



Use good judgment and have fun.

It’s a sit-inside kayak…
It’s most definitely a sit-inside kayak, Guideboatguy.

Okay

– Last Updated: Oct-30-14 10:01 AM EST –

I couldn't picture a molded-in seat which completely eliminates access beneath the rear deck being something you'd see on a sit-in kayak, so I made the assumption it was a SOT. Does this also mean that the space below the rear deck is connected to the cockpit? If so, leakage is no big deal, and this would be my crazy idea:

Buy a five-gallon bucket with a screw-on lid. Cut a hole in the top of the rear deck to receive the bucket. To anchor the bucket in place in a manner that is quick and easy, bolt a few straps to the inside of the hull, run them up along the sides of the bucket, pull them tight, and bolt them to the bucket above the deck. You now have a waterproof storage compartment that won't fall out even though it only took five minutes to anchor in place. Even though it's a little tall, it will allow you to place much of your gear lower than the top of the rear deck (generally a better situation than having all of it tied to the top of the deck).

One question that remains is how much that 3-D curvature associated with the current storage well works to stiffen the hull. Will the top deck be a floppy mess once you've cut that part out? I don't know.

Couple of things

– Last Updated: Oct-30-14 1:24 AM EST –

I assume there is a foam pillar back there if not for flotation then to keep the back deck from caving in if you kneel on it. Take a yardstick or old car antenna and poke around back there under the seat. Removing it would weaken your hull.
Cutting out the bottom of the hatch probably wouldn't have much effect but if you cut a big hole all around the hatch I think the back deck would become a floppy mess.
And the show stopper, sealing the joint. Especially if the joint needs to be able to support hull integrity.
I don't see how any modification to the rear deck is going to improve on water access to storage. And if you can't reach a deck bag one of those aftermarket round access plates with attached dry bag probably won't help a lot either. We use fanny packs when paddling the rec boats. Just wear it backwards, it could even go outside the spray skirt.

There is also a half skirt think called a splash deck, it puts a cover over the front of the cockpit to block wind and splashes but is not attached to your body so you could still use your deck bag. Mine has zippered pockets and a deep cup holder in it

As for flotation, yes it is frequently recommended one size fits all advice. It's important for whitewater I gather, I don't paddle whitewater. It is important for large bodies of water where I paddle double bullheaded sea kayaks. If you can wade to shore you don't need it.

The molded seat blocks access
Because the boat is made in two pieces. The bottom hull piece is a wide open dugout canoe shape. The deck piece has the seat molded in to it. When they attach the top, the seat hangs down inside and touches the bottom, usually resting on some little blocks of foam. No room to reach past the seat into the rear of the hull.

Maybe you can do better online

– Last Updated: Oct-30-14 7:52 AM EST –

I couldn't find anything on this boat from Pelican's own site. And since all we have are WW or sea kayaks, I don't have anything to look at myself. If the hull is thin enough, putting it in bright light could show a useful outline. I think I saw that you did, but since my inventory is not so robust as yours the next best bet was to see if the folks at Dick's would know since it appears to be made for them.

Okay, I can picture that (NM)

structural integrity
Something that would concern me is that a thinly molded plastic item may lose some structural integrity if you cut a large chunk of the shell out. One way manufacturers can get away with using less material in molded items is to make shapes with some complexity. Like that old trick of pleat folding a dollar bill so it will support a bottle of beer, having three dimensional forms in a material reinforces it against being deflected. Maybe not a realistic problem here since you don’t paddle in conditions that would risk torquing or twisting the boat.



Perhaps a more practical issue is that any such modification will likely reduce the resale value of the kayak.



If you invest in a deck bag ( which could be mounted on the stern deck as well) it will be something you will have to outfit your next kayak as well.