https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCyikqdIhmY&t=461s Nice video I showed my paddling partner instead of telling her which makes it easier than her getting mad.
Or even better is to take a lesson with her and let someone else point it out, while at the same time pointing out some deficiencies in your own technique.
I’ve always noticed that actual paddling is not quite as perfect as a dry land demo. Especially on long trips, I tend to get into a rhythm and comfort zone that might not be exactly technically correct, but it gets me where I’m going with the least amount of effort and wasted motion. I do try very hard to be aware of torso rotation, but exaggerated rotation wastes energy and is not compatible with good rhythm and tempo.
Greg Barton and Oscar Chalupsky made an excellent video on the forward stroke…if you can find a copy at a reasonable price.
@Sparky961 said:
Or even better is to take a lesson with her and let someone else point it out, while at the same time pointing out some deficiencies in your own technique.
I had a few. She is not enthusiastic about a lesson. She went for rescue class so she’s wearing my balaclava and guy dumps her over. Said he thought she was experienced because of gear she had. If she was experienced she wouldn’t need self exit class. Right now I need to get the 215 kalliste out of her hands for a 205 Cyprus or 210. Like to make it up there Marshall before cold because she doesn’t like the cold.
She like my 205 lkelos but blades to big I think. She felt it after a 12 mile paddle.
@Rookie said:
Greg Barton and Oscar Chalupsky made an excellent video on the forward stroke…if you can find a copy at a reasonable price.
I’ll look. I have about ten vids now few on forward strokes.
@Rookie said:
Greg Barton and Oscar Chalupsky made an excellent video on the forward stroke…if you can find a copy at a reasonable price.
Holy crap. First search turned it up on Amazon for over $100! Too rich for my blood.
We need a “Paddling.com lending library”…
that’s insane are they coming over to watch it with me after they sign it?
Oscar needs a new job.
@Sparky961 said:
@Rookie said:
Greg Barton and Oscar Chalupsky made an excellent video on the forward stroke…if you can find a copy at a reasonable price.Holy crap. First search turned it up on Amazon for over $100! Too rich for my blood.
We need a “Paddling.com lending library”…
If you look in the used section, it’s available for much less - but still more than what I paid for my copy, which I think was $20.
Epic used to sell it but can’t find it on their website. Maybe because Chalupsky left Epic for Nelo and his name is mud at Epic?
Hmm, that DVD is performing better than my bank…
Yesterday I went out with no particular destination in mind and thought I would do what I could to analyze my forward stroke and correct what I thought might be deficient. My conclusion was that as regards my cruising stroke, I’m either doing it right, or it’s as good as it’s likely to get. Any changes I attempted, just didn’t feel right, or altered my cadence, or length of stroke and the efficiency seemed to suffer.
It took me many, many years of tweaking (as in small changes) my style to get me where I am with it, so for now anyway–if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.
How long have others worked on their cruising forward stroke and is it a work in progress, or a done deal?
I always try to rotate and drive with my feet. When I began with a kayak paddle I paid close attention to the rotation and paddle box, and it became ingrained. I find i tend to leave the paddle in the water too far past my hip. If i am lifting at my hip I go faster, and the cadence picks up. If i want to relax I just slow the cadence, but still lift at my hip.
I found in archery an ingrained bad habit may feel right, but robs accuracy. It is very hard to correct and requires constant mindfulness until the correct technique becomes the ingrained habit. Back sliding when tired can still result. So it is really important to get it right from the start.
always trying to critic myself. I also watch the videos I have repeatedly. When I get tired I may get off beat or sloppy but not to often. I need to video myself passing the dock.
Now that said the fastest stroke would be right next to the hull with the blade very upright if you were in calm water trying o go as fast as possible?
@magooch said:
How long have others worked on their cruising forward stroke and is it a work in progress, or a done deal?
How long? Three years, excluding at least five months of winter each year.
The evening I bought my first kayak (had never been in one before), I Googled “forward stroke” and the first hit was Greg Barton’s short video in that see-through half-kayak. So that’s what I stuck with, studied (getting the full video) and attempted to do.
Four kayaks later, still working on it every time I paddle. No idea if I’m doing it right; only feedback received during my last class was to exit at my knees, so that’s what’s been added to my practice menu last couple of months.
Thought it was exit at thighs? Knees would.leave a real short stroke.
@PaddleDog52 said:
Thought it was exit at thighs? Knees would.leave a real short stroke.
While doing some reading about the forward stroke, I found this quote at Epic:
“Barton believes you should start to take the blade out of the water when it passes your knees and it should be completely out of the water as it passes your hip.”
http://www.epickayaks.com/article/article/bartons-forward-stroke
So, I’m guessing my blade wasn’t completely out of the water soon enough, thus the advice to exit at my knees.
Ditto… comes out of water at hip. Going past hip we are lifting water. We also tend to collapse the box past the hip. At least that is my understanding.
I guess if your arms are five feet long, or more and your legs are about a foot long, exiting at the knees might work for you.
My paddle stays in the water right up to my hips and I am not lifting water as the paddle leaves the water. This is a low angle cruising stroke and at a low angle, the paddle comes out of the water on edge. Some might say it is an ultra low angle, but it works for me. It seems to work very well with a wing too.
I’ve watched a lot of videos of paddlers and whether they admit it, or not, the pulling arm does bend a bit at the end of the stroke–unless the paddler has very short arms. I don’t see a down side to allowing a bit of flexing the arm at the end of the stroke if it doesn’t get sore, or tired after paddling all day. I’ve tried every way there is and trying to rigidly maintain a perfect paddler’s box, abbreviates the stoke, or requires an exaggerated torso rotation that will wear you out prematurely.
Everyone will have differences depending on how they’re built. I am 6’-2", long armed and not an ounce of fat on this 74 year old body. I’m not saying that I can’t improve my technique, I just know what works. I’m strictly referring to my cruising stroke; powering up, or sprinting changes everything. And speaking of powering up, my advice is even for much younger paddlers, use some caution about going full on, because you can strain something severely if you overdo it. I think our muscles tend to get stronger than the tendons and joints.
Good point. Just a few power strokes, esp. if you aren’t used to them can leave you in pain for weeks.
@string said:
Good point. Just a few power strokes, esp. if you aren’t used to them can leave you in pain for weeks.
What’s a power stroke? Couldn’t find anything on it in Nigel Foster’s latest book. Googling it brought me to Roger Schumann’s (ACA L5) video (noted below) which looks like a regular forward stroke. Did find some info on it for whitewater kayaking, but not sure why you would want to do that in a sea kayak, unless you were racing.