You really like following other people,
don’t you ?
In groups?
Not everybody does that.
Safety FIRST. Which is safer for the newbie vacation visitor going out for a short spin on the windy lake, on impulse, by themselves, the stable sot or the tippy rec boat ? Which can self rescue ? Which can be used as a swimming platform for teenagers ?
Think Outside the Big Box, dear.
Camden 120 by Old Town
when I was trying to decide it came down to the Pungo 120 vs the Camden 120 by Old Town. I bought the Camden 120 and I love it. The seat is very comfortable and it is easy to paddle. I went with the Aqua Bound Sting Ray carbon paddle which is very light and sturdy to paddle with.
I think maybe
– Last Updated: Jul-21-15 5:03 PM EST –
someone who has to turn their boat sideways to avoid swamping in power boat wake, and who thinks a surf ski is synonymous with "more stable SOT" ought to pause before offering such detailed advice. Let alone the sexist tone.
do yourself some favors
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1. It sounds like you want a SINK. Don't be dissuaded if that's what you want; there is just as broad a range in stability and speed as there is in SOTs. Personally I think the Pungo is a good entry-level flatwater SINK.
2. Check the classified ads here and on Craigslist for used boats providing more value for your dollar. Kayaks are pretty tough but the resale is low.
3. What was #3? (that was a reference to Gov. Perry). Dumping isn't a big deal...so try it on a calm warm day nearshore, just so you know what to do when it happens offshore.
what is a “tippy rec boat”?
I’ve never paddled one. But I did swim plenty of times from my own rec boat before moving on to a touring kayak. It was actually to re-enter without using a reentry and roll than my touring kayaks.
Have you ever actually paddled a SINK? There’s quite a range. Almost like SOTs.
Speed and Effort, Longer vs shorter
Angstrom is right. There have been a few people on these boards through the years who used to point out this comparison a lot. All else being equal, or as equal as you are likely to find when comparing boats of different length, shorter boats are easier to paddle at the kinds of speeds that most recreational paddlers go. Longer boats only become easier to paddle than short boats at speeds which are approaching the top speed that the shorter boat can be forced to go. “Faster” and “easier to paddle” are two characteristics that do NOT typically go together when comparing similar boats. Typically, you cannot have both. This of course, does not include comparisons between boats that are sleek and other boats that are slower on account of generally being barge-like in design.
Doesn’t sound like a voice of experience
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... to me. That bit about swamping being more of a risk when taking waves sideways than when taking them head-on (along with that incorrect stuff earlier about longer boats being easier, posted (and disputed) above) makes me wonder what this person even knows. It is true that lots of people are more comfortable taking bigger waves head-on because they don't like getting knocked back and forth in flat-bottomed boats when taking them sideways, but turning head-on to approaching waves to reduce the risk of swamping? Think about it. When does your boat dive more deeply into the water, or even get over-topped by waves. Is it when taking waves sideways, or head-on? Anyone who paddles in waves knows the answer.
The slowest paddler I know…
… is a small woman who paddles a high-volume long sea kayak that’s just too big for her. The main reason she bought it was that no one explained to her what a glaring error it is to equate faster potential top speed with easier paddling (yes, it has the potential to be a very fast boat, but not when paddled by someone lacking the strength required to make it go fast). The fact that the cockpit has sides that are too high for her, the boat is heavier than it needs to be, and it’s just generally ungainly when paddled by a small person, are just factors that multiply the effect of the original error.
I’m reading so much
blatantly stupid sh*t here in this thread from people trying to sell end of season overpriced cheap plastic crap from China with feminine logos to a person who’s taller than average for their gender, so this means they must use a short kayak and a short paddle because being women they just CAN’T HANDLE a normal length boat let alone a normal length paddle, I am seriously wondering if any of you actually have BEEN in a kayak - other than on a computer keyboard simulation.
But do carry on. Some of us need the humor aspect.
To the original poster-
You and your family need to be wearing personal floatation devices, aka " life vests" when you paddle. In the water. That way, when Bubba Stupid SkiDoo swamps your boat and you can’t self rescue, you can have a better chance to swim to shore, mmm, okay ?
I just thought I’d put that in there because I want to see Women’s Kayaks For Sale Keyboard Club start the subthread about how midwesterners are such fine natural swimmers they don’t need pfds.
Pungo and Tribute
May I ask why some think the Pungo will limit me? I’ve been watching CL for awhile and nothing seems to pop up within 200 miles of my house or cottage. I also looked for the Tribute and it’s not sold anywhere around me.
Badger
The Pungo will be fine for your purpose. There’s a reason they’re so popular. Just don’t forget the safety gear, and do get a decent paddle. Have fun!
Limitations
The limitation of the Pungo is the width (as do most ec kayaks) and the fact it has a insanely huge cockpit so you can fit a child, dog, or case of beer in front of you.
The width issue makes the kayak very stable on calm water but limits your speed and also makes the kayak less stable as waves get steeper or in something like ocean surf. If you only use the kayak on your lake under nice conditions this won’t be an issue. You may have minor issues with wakes if you have a bunch of speed boaters or the occasional opps moment.
The really large cockpit makes beginners not feel trapped. All sizes fit in them. You can have stuff in front of you and have sun on your legs. You can move around a bit. A good fitting kayak you have body contact with the hull with your hips, thighs, and feet. People describe it as wearing a kayak. You don’t wear a Pungo, you sit in it. The lower part of your body is active and engaged with the kayak. Losing that impacts your ability to control the kayak as well as the strength of your paddle. Losing that contact is not a big deal if you just want a mellow paddle. Not having that contact is a big deal in rougher water, if you want to paddle faster, have more control, or cover longer distances.
The bigger cockpit also means more ability to take on water. An issue if waves are breaking over your hull; not an issue if the water is calm.
Those are the main reasons why that kayak is limiting. It may not be limiting if your only goal is to just take a kayak out for a couple hours on mellow water, enjoy nature, stop and chat with your fellow paddlers and take some duck pics. That is recreational style paddling – slow and relaxing. The Pungo is well made, nice seat, and nice looking. It is just not made for distance, speed, or rougher water. Lots of us started (like me) in short little rec kayaks (me: Otters, Loons) and grew bored of the limitations. Other people I know have been very happy paddling the same Pungo for a decade.
I always thought this was a good explanation just in case we have all confused the hell out of you. http://www.watergirlsatplay.com/blog/how-to-choose-the-right-recreational-kayak/
nonsequitor
My comment was specifically about paddle length. Your reply is about everything but, trying to start a new fight. Which by the way makes no sense. I am sure there is a coherent thought in there from your end, but it not coming through in what you wrote.
Perhaps a little thinking inside the box would good for your exchanges here.
Pungo
That definitely makes sense! I know I’ve asked this a few times but what is the alternative then? There are so many options but it’s hard to find a lot of them around my area surprisingly. The shop that’s 5 miles from my cottage has the Pungo, Camden, and then the Dagger Zydeco. Then there’s another place about 30 miles away that has the Dirigo. The place by my house (60 miles from my cottage) has the Pungo and then thr Prodigy. Otherwise there’s always Dunham’s and Gander Mountain but it was stated in this thread that they are crap. I’d prefer picking up a used one but there aren’t any around and the ones I’ve seen are pretty high priced. For example there was a 2013 Pungo 100 for sale for $615.
pungo limitations
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Again, not dissing this boat for where it shines. And of course it is always challenging to make a good judgement for your needs from the other end of a blig. We could all be full of sh**. So, my answer to that question.
A pungo has a huge cockpit, which means that if you get swamped by a wave you will have a lot of gallons of water in there. Water is very heavy, enough of it and it really compromises a boat's stability. Hence the smaller cockpit areas of sea kayaks. It also makes it very heavy to manage in terms of flipping it around and getting the water out, at least in the way you would do an on water rescue with a sea kayak.
Thst is the purpose of a skirt in a sea kayak, to keep water out. The sheer size of the cockpit in a pungo means that you likely cannot find a skirt that won't implode if a huge lot of water hits it.
Some of the pungos, until you get to the 120, also lack flotation at both ends. So theoretically, should these boats capsize, the boat could end.up pointing straight down. Nothing short of a friendly motor boat is going to fix that. Hence the recommendation to add a float bag in anything smaller than the 120.
Have l personally seen a boat do this, no. But l have never been around a capsize wheRe some among paddling group failed to get the swimmer pretty quickly, even when it was not one of our group. I have personally tried to do a rescue of a kid in an unbulkheaded rec boat at a demo day. I finally had to ask a couple of the guys to haul the half filled rec boat back while l carried the kid on my back deck. The water made too heavy. Even in a sea kayak l could not do anything effective with the boat.
On the flip side, until a pungo gets swamped it is a comfortable, pretty well tracking boat that most people will have a very hard time flipping in the flat water that is its intended environment. I knows someone who managed, but he had to do a couple of things really wrong at the same time and weigh over 200 lbs.
They are not my boat but l have seen them work for great for guys who paddle within rec boat conditions. I have not yet seen a woman who seemed to be having as easy a time with one, though l just may have encountered the wrong female and pungo combination.
A half skirt
will prevent most water from entering the cockpit. On the OP’s lake, the water will come from paddle drip, not huge waves.
I started out with a Necky Rip 10 (because I didn’t know any better). Same 29" beam as the Pungo 120 being considered. Large cockpit, very stable. I live on an inland lake and after a couple of weeks, I enjoyed riding the waves from the ski boats and jet skis. Yes, water in the cockpit was a PITA, but a half skirt solved that.
I didn’t lilydip. I paddled that boat as fast as I could and developed a pretty strong forward stroke from doing so. That was the only benefit of the big cockpit: it allowed full hip rotation.
The Pungo 120 is a better boat than the Necky Rip 10. I moved to a different boat within six weeks because I wanted to paddle the Great Lakes. Badger has stated he has no plans to move the kayaks from his own inland lake, so I think he’ll be fine.
She may have found true peace tho
by letting the people being annoyingly judgmental about her appearance in said craft, go on ahead… out of earshot.
Another day of kayak shopping
So I went to a few more stores north of my cottage today. I stressed my concern about taking on water and such and everyone said that shouldn’t be a concern of mine on the my cottage is on. It would have to be pretty rough to have water come over. They said I should get a 10’ and a 12’ but I’m not totally sure. Everyone is pushing the Pungo, then another place was selling the Dagger Axis and Old Town Dirigo. Do any of those seem suitable for my needs?
Been there, done that
Don’t buy a ten-foot kayak. Go for the 12-footers.
Angstrom gave excellent advice early in this thread (third response). Might help to take another look at it.
Sun Dolphin Aruba
So what’s your thoughts on the Aruba 12?