Prijon does use good plastic
Angstrom- or it’s their extrusion blow molding process, rather than rotational molding, which could conceivably give it some solidity.
I’d probably put the Barracuda on the list but I would rather have a skeg. Also, when Cooldoctor tells me that he has stopped dumping in his new Cuda, I’ll take a closer look.
Thanks to all again who have been offering thoughtful advice.
Keep the advice coming for bruce.
I have stopped dumping the Cuda, but only in flatwater… but it is lickety split. Waves? Who knows. I will try this summer. Bruce does not wish to take the plunge – hardee har har – in buying another Prijon until he can see that all other kayaks are, indeed, inferior.
So, until then, keep all your suggestions coming. If we p-netters can name string’s dog, I am sure we can find a kayak for bruce.
If you thought the Nighthawk…
wasn’t fast, you probably won’t be impressed with the Avocet’s speed. I have rented both of those and the Avocet felt slower than the Nighthawk. The T165 is faster (for me, at least) than either of those.
I liked the snugger fit of the Avocet much better than the Nighthawk’s, but I am not the same size as you. The Nighthawk also had a painfully tall backband, but that could probably be retrofitted with something else.
You really should demo your “short list”. I bought my T165 without demo’ing (none available to even sit in around here) and took a calculated risk that hit bullseye. But I don’t recommend doing so when you actually have a good selection of kayaks to demo near you.
In rotomold, maybe you can find a Dagger Cortez 16. They are supposed to be among the fastest of the rotomolds. They do have a rudder, not a skeg. Have heard this is a hull that “needs” the rudder.
Maybe a Prijon Barracuda?
Textured water and speed
– Last Updated: Mar-18-06 10:00 AM EST –
For your size boats that are faster than average and handle textured water well I would think of the Aquanaut and Nordkapp LVs - the regular Aquanaut is faster than most and very well mannered in challenging seas. I've heard good things about the LV. The Nordkapp is a legendary boat and the glowing appraisals of the LV has put it on many paddlers' lists.
A Foster Silhouette is a very fast Brit syle boat, and when built by Seaward, unsurpassed quality.
For speed in a sea kayak the Epic Endurance 18 and the QCC longer narrower boats are faster than most others except racing kayaks.
Recent record time challanging crossings have been made in an Endurance 18 and the Valley Rapier.
wilsoj2- I sat in the Nordkapp LV
for a long time at Canoecopia. It looked and felt beautiful. I can readily understand why it would be on everyone’s wish list. As I was sitting in it, I pictured it gliding through tangled foliage, fallen trees, and assorted detritus on some Illinois rivers or being launched from concrete ramps. Sort of like putting a moustache on the Mona Lisa.
If I were to launch from pristine sandy beaches the Nordkapp LV would be at or near the top of the list.
The plastic Aquanaut (which is medium volume) was not as comfortable for me as the low volume Nordkapp. A little roomy.
I also know that the first plastic Nordkapps will be in the US in three weeks but they are also medium volume boats.
might
– Last Updated: Mar-16-06 6:33 PM EST –
consider two boats...one for the rivers and tangled mess and one for gliding out into the pristine lakes ...a sleek runner (glass) and a beater for the concrete (money is no object)
Best Wishes
Roy
if you go plastic for the Lake trips, after 20 miles on Lake Michigan...your candle will be burned lower than if you use glass...there is a differace. not so much in speed, but lots of loss in glide and effort.
Good suggestion Roy
– Last Updated: Mar-16-06 6:43 PM EST –
I intend on keeping the Calabria for the truly difficult conditions. I once envisioned taking a glass or kevlar boat only to Lake Michigan with the soft beaches but I'm not yet sure how many times I'll be on the big lake this year. If Lake Michigan were to be the primary paddling destination, I would probably buy composite. I still have not yet ruled fiberglass out.
How about plastic Aquanaut and minicell
Poly Nordkapp
Last word from Peter Orton was that the poly Nordkapp would be between the standard and LV in size. Might be worth waiting to try.
BTW, I wouldn’t be concerned about launching a composite Valley boat from concrete boat launches. I’ve done it quite a few times with my Aquanaut over the past couple of years and it’s fine.
I wouldn’t worry about the Nordkapp seeming out of place for some of your paddling. Until getting a day boat this year, I was using my Aquanaut for such paddling. If you have a Nordkapp, you have a NORDKAPP! Use it for anything you like. And when you have it in textured seas you may be smiling more tham most.
I second the Falcon 16
Rutabega even has a used one in kevlar. Nice fast hull for a small to mid paddler at a great price.
http://www.rutabaga.com/boat_specials.asp
Buy it and a plastic Avocet and you’ll have two nice boats. One thats fast and surfs wind waves well for Lake MI and one thats more manueverable and durable for Urban paddling.
curious
Bruce
are you the person that I was talking to, who was sitting in the red over white Nordkapp for a really long time while you talked about buying it or the avocete or maybe the LV or maybe the avocete or maybe the LV? same money, money down on one could be transfered to become money on the other. I talked to your wife awhile in the check-out line earlier in the day?
just curious, didn’t see a P-Net name tag
Best Wishes
Roy
Here’s another idea…
– Last Updated: Mar-16-06 9:39 PM EST –
Though it may be difficult to find someone willing to part with theirs, if you can find a Mariner "Elan" to try, you might be pretty impressed. Matt and Cam have recently retired, and at this point, I don't think that anyone has picked up production of their "Mariner" boats.
The Mariner boats have a pretty unique hull design (soft chine at the bow, morphing into a hard chine, then a "built in skeg" at the stern). The "Elan" was their "full featured sea kayak" for the smaller paddler (150 lb. maximum recommended paddler weight, I think). I had a chance to paddle one of these a while back, and I was quite impressed.
As I said though, since this boat is both very nice and out of production, you might have a very hard time finding one on the used boat market. Keep your eyes open though, and you just might get lucky.
Edit:
By the way, here are a couple reviews of the Elan:
This one is here on Pnet, by Sanjay (hey, I haven't seen Sanjay post in a while, does anyone know where he is?):
http://www.paddling.net/Reviews/showReviews.html?prod=1077
Here's the Sea Kayaker Magazine review:
http://www.marinerkayaks.com/mkhtml/elnrvtxt.html
Coincidentally, that review was in the issue of Sea Kayaker that featured a picture of me on the cover! (April, 1999) :-)
Melissa
cooldoctor1 - Silhouette
– Last Updated: Mar-17-06 8:17 AM EST –
Yes...
Very fast and capable boat. On our paddle out to Eastern Egg Rock this past July, one of the paddlers was in a Silhouette. The boat seemed to glide effortlessly. It also looked very nice.
I'm a bit large for a Silhouette (this was confirmed by Nigel Foster) and am more comfortable in a Legend.
Greenlander LV
I used to drool over the photo of the Greenlander LV on the NDK website. Any ideas what happened to the site?
I don’t remember if we talked Roy
I did have a P.net tag on with an Illinois sweatshirt. I don’t remember speaking with anyone except the Valley sales personnel while sitting in the Nordkapp. If the person you were speaking with was good-looking, suave and sophisticated, it probably wasn’t me. My wife talked to all the guys there so you were probably one of them. We were never on the check-out line because we did not buy anything.
I would have liked to meet you though.
Thanks wilsoj2- I may wait for the
poly Nordkapp if, as you say, it is between the standard and the LV. I think one of the dealers in Illinois will be getting one in inventory with one of the early containers.
awesome kayak…
The Silhouette was my latest in a long line of kayak purchases and it is by far my favorite kayak. I’m pretty much the same size as bruce (5’8", 145 lbs, size 9 shoes) and it feels great. It’s fast, it rolls ridiculously well, it’s comfortable… The only think is that for some people it may be a bit tippy but for me it was perfect.
Silhouette looks very cool Cooldoctor
– Last Updated: Mar-17-06 8:53 AM EST –
Schizo and wilsoj2. At 17'10" with a 20.5" beam it may be a little bit over my level. Contrary to the philosophy of some on P.net, I don't want to stretch myself and grow into a boat. I just want to put it in the water and paddle.
I may need it in a few years however to keep up with the young studs like you- I turned 56 yesterday.