[OT]Got that t-shirt too
"Kid may not like paddling,may love ballet?"
Very tricky/difficult to encourage kids to do what you like to do as well as accept that they do not and value/encourage what they like to do.
Kids and kayaks
Your quest for the most refined hull for paddling is a good lesson in what is on your new horizon. You’ve learned that hulls come in various sizes, shapes and behaviors. Non perfect and all interesting. Some behave the way you want them to and others less so. But they all got you on the water. Kids come like kayaks in all sizes, shapes and personalities, but they will take you out into a bigger ocean and if you are real lucky you might get one of solid build with limited cosmetic issues and likes to be an Explorer. Good luck, trust and care for the design and it will be a worthy paddle.
Custome made how?
Oh, I think we could get started debating about blade width, thickness, taper, loom length, shape and size to an extent at least equal to the foregoing “perfect” boat discussions. And if NDK folks have drunk kool aid, GPers tend to have been bitten and are rabid.
Various responses…
I was kidding about pushing the kid down the paddling path. I agree that kids need to do what they want and that you can’t push them too much…but ballet might be where I draw the line (God help me).
OCD about paddling? Me? Definitely. I admit it. Probably about other things too, oh well. I prefer to refer to it as being “passionate.”
The perfect paddle…I’ve been down that road already! I tried a few different styles but for me the real challenge was finding the right length. I went from 215 to 210 to 205 to 210, and back and forth and different lengths in different blade styles.
I finally settle on a pair: a 205 crank shaft Ikelos and a matching Cyprus. The Cyprus is great for cruising and the Ikelos is great for surfing and tidal races. Good match.
Matt
See, you need two boats
"The Cyprus is great for cruising and the Ikelos is great for surfing and tidal races. Good match."
And you need boats to match as well. Keep that NordLV, you will be glad you did…maybe.
EEL - which for what?
“The Cyprus is great for cruising and the Ikelos is great for surfing and tidal races. Good match.”
And you need boats to match as well. Keep that NordLV, you will be glad you did…maybe.
EEL
So which niche does the Nordy LV fit and which one does the Explorer fit - I can’t figure it out…
Nordlow = Fun, Explorer = Reassurance
The Nordlow provides the fun and the Explorer provides the security/reassurance 
Matt, the Army is lucky to have you.
You are really a testament for the testing of things. Good luck on the quest for the perfect kayak. If you find it, let Sir Gawain, Galahad, Lancelot and the rest of the Camelot crew know. I sure haven’t found one, but ya never know, the be all and end all of kayaks is probably around the corner.
Dogmaticus
My take…
I agree with Jim for the most part. The LV was a fun boat to paddle; however, I found it to be at its best in up to moderate conditions…or at least for me (body weight may have a lot to do with it).
I was disappointed with its performance in the surf and in extremely rough ocean conditions. There I think the Explorer gets the nod. In these conditions I found that the boat would broach quickly when surfing and was very squirrelly in the rough and hard to keep on course. The lack of secondary stability was not optimal in beam seas either…and I just don’t like the fit of the LV. The placement of the thigh braces is not good for me. I always felt like my legs wanted to slip out from under them.
The issue I have with having two boats though is never being able to decide which one to use! Seems like a lot of times the conditions are kind of “in between” Also tends to decrease your enjoyment in some ways when switching boats.
Switching from my Greenlander Pro to my Avocet I would always feel like the boat was really slow. Switching back I would always feel like the GP was too hard to maneuver. I’m afraid I would have the same effect with the Explorer. I also found it took a while to get used to the much different stability profiles.
Paddling one boat allows you to really get to know it in all conditions. It allows you to develop a strong feel for the boat’s subtleties and not to “forget” and have to re-learn them by swapping out boats. I also find that there is a certain feel you develop with your forward stroke and your connection with the boat. Switching boats can have a small effect on the height at which you sit above the water which changes the effective length of your paddle.
Matt
It’s
good that your young yet…it’ll give you lots of time to change your opinions.
Best Wishes
Roy
Millipede who stalls
Someone I know would get hung up when trying to decide “Which bike should I use for those trails?” He only had two mountain bikes (a dual suspension and a front-suspension), yet this became a big deal. On the rides in question, either bike would have been fine–I was riding one of my two fully rigid mtn bikes. Yet he kept asking me which of his suspension bikes to use, LOL.
Finally I said, “Just toss some dice and get going!!!”
Don’t lose precious time dithering over relatively unimportant choices. And with a kid on the way, you are going to have a lot less paddling time.
re :Explorer for sale
FYI …thers a 2003 explorer for sale under the classified ad section here …it’s in NY. just wanted to bringthat to your attention.
hence
my decision to go with just one kayak that can do it all. No choices necessary.
Baby on the way…true but I don’t plan that to stop me from paddling. Guess I am going to have a battle on my hands with the wife over that issue…guess I better start lacing up the gloves!
Incidentally, I am a cyclist and mountain biker too. I have owned a lot of different bikes (as you might have guessed) although not quite as bad as my kayak ownership.
I would argue that the characteristics of boats vary quite a bit more than those of bikes in my opinion.
Much of the game with both bikes and boats is fit. Boats are a lot less adjustable than bikes in terms of fit (with bikes you can move the seat up and down, fore and aft, change the stem length and rise, change crank length, etc, etc…and all without changing frames). Furthermore, a lot boat fit has to do with its shape which is fixed. I also think boats are a lot more sensitive to paddler weight and distribution as well.
Boats also are much more dependent on user skill level, etc. Not quite so much with bikes. I would not every put a beginner in a Silhouette, nor in a boat that is as hard to turn as the OI, etc.
Not
so…find a hull that paddles the way you like…fit is only a matter of gutting the inside and re-doing it the way you like.
you can always change fit…sounds like you still think it has to come out of the box all ready to go or else.
boats are not all that finniky…even to weight unless it’s unbalance as in improperly trimmed by the paddler placing gear in a wrong place or by the paddler not knowing how to use their body weight to the best advantage for the water they are paddling.
Best Wishes
Roy
Valley hip hook…
"…and I just don’t like the fit of the LV. The placement of the thigh braces is not good for me. I always felt like my legs wanted to slip out from under them."
http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2474513540068902019JPZUJG
…helped a great deal
Finicky
Perhaps my wording was poor. When I say that boats are sensitive to paddler weight and distribution I am saying that boat handing can change significantly from one paddler to another becuase of differences in the paddler’s body weight and body weight disbribution (200 pounds 5’8 not the same as 200 pounds 6,2, etc)
Also true that some boats may be pushed to their limit by a paddler’s weight. For instanct (and I konw some disagree with me) but my old Avocet which I loved just did not handle the same for me after I gained about 20 pounds. I felt that at 200 pounds I was above the optimum weight range for the boat (which is true according to Valley’s site which recommends it for paddlers up to 190 I think). This is not the same with bikes.
As per fitting a boat. True. You can outfit a boat to fit, but not always. For instance my Greenlander Pro was a great boat, but I just did not like the rather straight-legged position / low front deck. No real way to change that. Somewhat true with the LV as well. A rather sraight-legged paddling position rather than a more frog-legged position like the Explorer which is better for me.
Some things can be changed with outfitting, while others are a lot harder to do so…or require some much messing with (which may not produce the results in the end that you want) that it doesn’t make it worth it.
Matt
Matt
I think Matt’s Right
I agree it only takes 20# sometimes in additional weight to make major changes in how a boat feels to a given paddler. Depends on boat and paddler. Boat behavior can also be changed noticeably by moving a seat an inch in one direction or another. While the idea to find a hull that you like and then do whatever is necessary to fit the boat to you has some logic, far better to find a boat with a hull that works and fits as well. After all, there are lots of boats out there and nearly all of them work fine for the right paddler. I do think having as many arrows in the quiver in terms of ability to adapt to different boat and cockpit styles, etc. will tend to make a more well rounded paddler and it is limiting to focus exclusively on one type of boat after you have the seat time in to have a solid foundation.
I see paddlers with boats they think they should have which do not fit, require major amounts of outfitting, require ballast to be trimmed right, have lots of freeboard, etc. I guess if it works, its works; but does not seem optimal to me and I think they are really missing the joy of a close coupled boat. Maybe I’m OCD too. Maybe its all a personal preference thing.
I agree it only takes…
a few pounds added or shifted to make some boats feel different.
I also agree with Ed that a quiver of boats may make for a more rounded paddler.
It’s been exhausting for us too man 
my thoughts
If I follow through on selling my OI, I 've been looking at same boats with these thoughts on what to get
Explorer - love to camp and do camp light but hate struggling with tiny hatch covers, after having a faster boat, don’t want a slower one
Quest - way too much volume for my size
Force 4 or Aquanaut LV - probable boats of choice