Good day all. New to the forums here. My wife and I will be picking up a couple of corelite X scorpios next week (21" and 22" wide boats), and I’m looking for some advice on performance paddles. I’ve read that a shorter than Werner site calculator recommended Ikelos is comfortable to paddle with while still allowing for powerful sprinting and better bracing/rolling where the Cyprus is the more “comfortable” paddle for all around use but not quite as capable for sprinting or as good at bracing/rolling. Both my wife and I are fairly strong paddlers, and we’re wondering about which would be a better choice for us. I’m 5’11" and she is 5’8" and want the ergonomics of a bent shaft. Here is what I was thinking for potential sizes of either paddle:
205 cm bent Ikelos for both of us
210 cm bent Cyprus for both of us or potentially a 215 for myself being a bit taller
Thank you in advance for any information, suggestions, and insight.
When you’re going to spend that much money on paddles, I would certainly want to try them out, before deciding on which one to go with. Personally I don’t like crankshafts, because I find shaft shifting to be very useful in conditions.
I would also be a bit leery of the Ikelos for a woman–that’s a lot of paddle. Frankly, I think it’s a lot of paddle for anyone of average physique. But I’m sure there will be differing opinions.
I’m also going to ask if you have considered just sticking with glass. The cost is way less and the weight difference in my opinion isn’t enough to make the difference.
Looked up the Ikelos to see how it compares to my own 210 Werner Cyprus (straight shaft) I’m 5’5" and paddle a 21" wide LV boat. Werner states the Ikelos is designed for the “larger” paddler. Not sure if that refers to height, weight, or both.
I don’t understand why one model would allegedly be better for bracing and rolling when one’s hips play such a major role. I’ve seen videos of kayakers doing great rolls without any paddle - and doing great braces with a Greenland paddle. Seems like good technique is what counts most.
Agree that you definitely need to try both paddles, hopefully for more than just 10 or 15 minutes.
Another one who thinks you should try both before you make up your minds.
But, just for reference, I’m 6’0" and 195lbs and in decent shape; I’m 66 but I run three or 4 times a week and work out. I’m a high angle paddler and very happy indeed with my 210cm bent shaft Cyprus (the island not the tree :o ).
It’s a personal thing obviously, but I can still shift the shaft and I much prefer the lighter weight of carbon. For me anyway, the cranked shaft is easier on my wrists.
My 5’0" wife, who is also in pretty good shape, prefers her straight shaft (with a smaller diameter that suits her smaller hands better) 200cm Cyprus.
I think the only reason to go with a much larger blade is if you are a much larger paddler, say 6’3" and a muscular 220lbs. I think that after a long paddle my shoulders thank me for the medium sized blade.
You said new to forum, but I didn’t catch if you were new to kayaking. Because you are buying all new kit, it does sound like you might at least be new to boat ownership?
I second the mention above by @magooch about going for fiberglass at first. Even with all the research you are doing, there is a very large chance that these paddles won’t be exactly right, so cutting the price down by $100+ per paddle might make any future changes less painful. I usually recommend the fiberglass level paddles for first paddles. they will be decent and could be used continuously if you get it right, but would still make good spare paddles to keep around should you not get it right.
If at all possible, demo the paddles you are interested in.
I’m also going to ask if you have considered just sticking with glass. The cost is way less and the weight difference in my opinion isn’t enough to make the difference.
The weight difference / swing weight difference seems significant to me with the Epic paddles - I greatly prefer the all carbon over the hybrid construction.
@Rex said:
NEITHER! Get yourself some Greenland paddles. I started Euro and made the switch.
I have a 1 piece carbon GP, but use my Euros, instead, because of the convenience of 2 piece for transport. I’d like to some day have a 2 piece carbon.
I’m a wimpy paddler that prefers smaller blades on my paddles. For me, in the Werner paddles, the Camano and Kalliste are the largest blade that I can tolerate. The Cyprus and Ikelos are too big for me.
I envy those of you whose bodies can handle those larger blades.
All personal taste. I have Current Designs Extreme 21.25" Solstice 24" and Libra tandem 32" wide. I have straight shafted Ikelos in 205 & 215. I am 6’ tall. I like the 215 for wide Libra XT. 205 is good for real high angle in the others kayaks especially the Extreme for speed pulling right next to hull with parallel stroke.
I think 215 is to long for your boats and height. Ikelos probably to big for you wife. She might like 205 cypress or Shuns. I was going to buy. 210 Ikelos but may get a 210 carbon corryvrecken.
I doubt it matters for bracing or rolling which paddle you get. I am not a weight lifter or body builder but fairly well built at 64 years old.
Nothing like trying them but for more than 15 minutes and possibly different conditions but not likely at a retailer.
The Ikelos is a quite big blade if I recall correctly. Sufficiently so that I know an woman paddler, not a tiny one, who can thank using that big a blade as part of the reason she had to get not one but both shoulders completely repaired. And I know a lot of bigger guys who use the Cyprus happily. And go plenty fast.
I would try to borrow and use an Ikelos, hard, for a couple of hours before deciding to actually live with one.
Thank you for all of the information. I’m a very muscular 215 lbs. at 5’11". I fear that if I have the ikelos then I’d leave my wife in the dust! Probably best for us to both have the Cyprus then. Do folks concur that I should be on a 210 and her on a 205 then?
@Emilio - You are underestimating the effectiveness of a good stroke and a blade size that makes it easy to increase your cadence. Too big a blade with a less efficient stroke is often slower because you have added more drag. You will understand this better after you have spent some time with a blade size that allows you to quickly alter cadence.
@Emile640 said:
Thank you for all of the information. I’m a very muscular 215 lbs. at 5’11". I fear that if I have the ikelos then I’d leave my wife in the dust! Probably best for us to both have the cypress then. Do folks concur that I should be on a 210 and her on a 205 then?
As you’ll find out, it’s not as simple as the bigger the blade the faster you’ll go.
I am much bigger and stronger than my wife, and my kayak is a foot longer than hers. At a flat out sprint - that I really wouldn’t be able to maintain for too long - I’m faster than she is, but we don’t race each other and at a decent cruising speed that we do 99% of the time we both keep up just fine. There are many more factors in play than just size and strength.
So would folks concur on the 210 and 205 cypress sizes for myself and my wife, or should I go with the Werner calculator and get us both 210 cm for our heights and widths of the boats?
Maybe you could bring home a 210 for yourself and then have your wife try it?
At 5’8" she would probably be fine with either although the ideal paddle is the shortest you can still fully immerse the blade with a normal paddle stroke. The shorter the paddle the lighter it will be, which is always a plus.
Also, see if you can at least have her at least hold a Werner with the smaller shaft diameter. That might suit her hands better.
I am 2 inches shorter than your wife and use Shuna and Cyprus 200cm straight shaft, standard diameter paddles. (I have long fingers.) For 8 years I was using 205cm versions of the same. I began wishing they were a little shorter. Then I noticed that Werner listed a 200cm size for them, which had not been available earlier. I bought the 200cm versions, and I also went down from 191cm to 185cm for my WW Sherpa paddle. They are perfect for me. The shorter length feels natural, and it is easier to sprint with.
Both of them are perfectly good for rolling and bracing and blended strokes. If you are failing rolls with those, the problem is technique, not equipment.